European Billionaires awaiting season cancellation

[vanlady]

I have been reading articles from europe recently about a strong group of European Billionaires waiting for the season to be cancelled to announce a European Super League. First time I have seen the article in English, even if it is Strachan, there has been plenty of back up in Swiss, German and Russian media. It also seems to be backed up by the flurry of arena building in Europe in the last year and a half.

One thought one of the Russian owners in this pact is richer than all 30 NHL owners combined.

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/2005/02/13/929881-sun.html

Click to read more...

 

[ryz]

LOL..... Strachan..... SURE

 

[futurcorerock]

Screw 'em. Once the NHL gets its wits together and promotes internationally, these punks will be in the gutter.

 

[Lanny MacDonald*]

That article is filled with plenty of holes and inaccuracies. How exactly does a "super league" take shape when there are not enough buildings in Europe to support the concept? You are going to need 20,000 seat arenas to generate the type of money needed to keep the players happy. You are going to need a fan base that will pay to see the product. Since Europeans are used to paying ten to twenty dollars a ticket I don't see a big market for the several hundred dollars a ticket required to generate the revenues to support the venture. Al Strachan is usually out to lunch, but in this case he's out for breakfast, lunch, dinner and a mid-night snack.

 

[barnburner]

Let them all go and play in Europe - forever.
Bring in a new group of young and hungry players, that do not think they are
more important than the game.

 

[tantalum]

Yes the flurry of arena building. Most of which are in the 10,000 seat range. The one in Cologne is the only NHL sized one at 18,500.

Attendance is up only 10% in Europe with all the NHLers....is it possible to see a further 50% jump in attendance necessary for a superleague?

Leagues aren't something that just spring up overnight. The NHL has considerbale time to settle this.

And if anyone is starting up a new league it will most likely be a capped one IMO.

A Superleague may spring up eventually but I don't see it challenging the NHL even with the lockout.

 

[Riddarn]

Pipe Dream. Maybe there could be something done in the area of Switzerland, Austria, Germany, Slovakia and the Czech Republic. Maybe. But the scandinavians would never be in on it and not the russians either.

 

[vanlady]

That article is filled with plenty of holes and inaccuracies. How exactly does a "super league" take shape when there are not enough buildings in Europe to support the concept? You are going to need 20,000 seat arenas to generate the type of money needed to keep the players happy. You are going to need a fan base that will pay to see the product. Since Europeans are used to paying ten to twenty dollars a ticket I don't see a big market for the several hundred dollars a ticket required to generate the revenues to support the venture. Al Strachan is usually out to lunch, but in this case he's out for breakfast, lunch, dinner and a mid-night snack.

You obviously haven't been keeping up, arenas have been built in Europe that have the same capacity as GM Place, most recently the Berlin Siemens arena, with a capacity of 18,500 with luxury boxes, no different than NA arenas. There are a lot of arenas in Europe with capacities of 13,000 - 19,000.

You seem to think that these owners look at teams as money makers. One of the Russian owners, Roman Abramovich, had a great quote. Professional sports teams aren't business for me, they are fun. And boy has he proved that with the Chelsea soccer team he owns.

 

[Pepper]

Doesn't work in Europe, all the previous attempts have proved it.

 

[Lanny MacDonald*]

You obviously haven't been keeping up, arenas have been built in Europe that have the same capacity as GM Place, most recently the Berlin Siemens arena, with a capacity of 18,500 with luxury boxes, no different than NA arenas. There are a lot of arenas in Europe with capacities of 13,000 - 19,000.

You seem to think that these owners look at teams as money makers. One of the Russian owners, Roman Abramovich, had a great quote. Professional sports teams aren't business for me, they are fun. And boy has he proved that with the Chelsea soccer team he owns.

I respectfully disagree with you. You have named one building, which is hardly enough for the support of a super league. Here are some numbers for you to consider.

European Hockey Arenas with capacity 10,000+

Andorra (0)

Armenia (0)

Austria (0)

Azerbaijan (0)

Belarus (0)

Belgium (0)

Bosnia and Herzegovina (0)

Bulgaria (0)

Belarus (0)

Croatia (0)

Czech Republic (1)

Team: HC Sparta Praha
Arena: T-Mobile Arena
Capacity: 14,660

Denmark (0)

Estonia (0)

Finland (2)

Team: Jokerit Helsinki
Arena: Hartwall Arena
Capacity: 13,665

Team: TPS Turku
Arena: Elysee Arena
Capacity: 11,820 (9,042 seated)

France (0)

Germany (3)

Team: Kolner Haie
Arena: Kolnarena (the one you make reference to)
Capacity: 18,500 (16,200 seated)

Team: Hamburg Freezers
Arena: Color Line Arena
Capacity: 13,886

Team: Dusseldorfer EG
Arena: Stadion an der Brehmstrasse
Capacity: 10,280

Greece (0)

Hungary (1)

Team: shared by three teams
Arena: Kisstadion
Capacity: 15,000

Iceland (0)

Ireland (0)

Israel (0)

Italy (0)

Kazakhstan (0)

Latvia (0)

Liechtenstein (0)

Lithuania (0)

Luxembourg (0)

Macedonia (0)

Malta (0)

Netherlands (0)

Norway (0)

Poland (0)

Portugal (0)

Romania (0)

Russia (0)

Serbia and Montenegro (0)

Slovakia (0)

Slovenia (0)

Spain (0)

Sweden (2)

Team: Djurgardens IF
Arena: Stockholm Globe Arena
Capacity: 13,850

Team: Vastra Frolund Indians HC
Arena: Scandinavium
Capacity: 12,192

Switzerland (2)

Team: SC Bern
Arena: Eisstadion Allmend
Capacity: 16,771

Team: ZSC Lions
Arena: Hallenstadion
Capacity: 11,500

Turkey (0)

Ukraine (0)

United Kingdom (1)

Team: Manchester Phoenix
Arena: Evening News Arena
Capacity: 17,500

Source: eurohockey.net

As you can see there have been some arenas constructed that are bigger than your average European building, but they are still small in comparison to NHL buildings. In fact, both Winnipeg and Quebec would be large market buildings, ones that were proven to be incapable of supporting the salary demands of NHL players.

Would you care to offer up a little more proof or would you prefer to retract your erroneous statement? Back to you kind lady.

 

[SENSible1*]

You obviously haven't been keeping up, arenas have been built in Europe that have the same capacity as GM Place, most recently the Berlin Siemens arena, with a capacity of 18,500 with luxury boxes, no different than NA arenas. There are a lot of arenas in Europe with capacities of 13,000 - 19,000.

Please provide a list of all arenas which hold more than 16,000.

 

[wazee]

Another amusing article from Al. With all the advantages Europe has over North America, one must conclude that the NHL is doomed with or without a salary cap. No matter how this labor dispute turns out, it is only a matter of time before the Europeans put together a league that the new world cannot possible compete with. Doomed we are. Doomed.

 

[SJeasy]

I don't recall where I read it, but a note of caution to the NHL seems to be that a very limited number of players like Kovalchuk would see similar money playing in their home country. Some European owners may not be averse to spending over $3mil for a single player (while the rest of their players receive $100-200k).

 

[vanlady]

Doesn't work in Europe, all the previous attempts have proved it.

The reason it has never worked in Europe is a lack of 3 things. Infrastructure, well that is gone, heck even Manchester England has an NHL size arena now. 2. TV, thanks to the lockout the european TV contracts are becoming very lucrative, in some circles they are saying there deals are better than the NHL national TV deal in the States. 3. Owners that financially did not compare to NA owners, that has radically changed, most of the owners that we are talking about are far wealthier than the current NHL owners.

 

[CarlRacki]

One thought one of the Russian owners in this pact is richer than all 30 NHL owners combined.

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/2005/02/13/929881-sun.html

Really? Back up that ridiculous statement with some facts, please.

Comcast is worth $109 billion. There's some guy in Russia worth more than that? Not according to Forbes.

 

[Riddarn]

The reason it has never worked in Europe is a lack of 3 things. Infrastructure, well that is gone, heck even Manchester England has an NHL size arena now. 2. TV, thanks to the lockout the european TV contracts are becoming very lucrative, in some circles they are saying there deals are better than the NHL national TV deal in the States. 3. Owners that financially did not compare to NA owners, that has radically changed, most of the owners that we are talking about are far wealthier than the current NHL owners.

You're wrong. The main reason it doesn't work is because fans don't give a crap about teams from other countries, except when it comes to national team play which is a whole another deal. It has been proven again and again.

 

[Hoek]

They can't even get a soccer "Super League" going yet and a hockey one is supposed to be a legit possibility? LOL I think not. And if soccer gets its act together in that regards this hockey league would get crushed rather quickly.

 

[jcab2000]

I think the rebirth of the WHA is more likely than this crap.

 

[vanlady]

Please provide a list of all arena's which hold more than 16,000.

I can think of 4 without even looking it up. The new arenas in Berlin and Cologne Germany both have Capacities over 18,500, the Manchester Arena is over 17,000 and the home of SC Bern which is close to 17,000. That wasn't tough.

 

[Steve L*]

Really? Back up that ridiculous statement with some facts, please.

Comcast is worth $109 billion. There's some guy in Russia worth more than that? Not according to Forbes.

If hes talking about the Chelsea owner then hes a multi billionairre who makes the Yankees owner look like Bill Wurtz with their $200m/year salary.

While the statement is wrong, there is some foundation in the fact that they could compete against the NHL for players.

 

[Albi]

I respectfully disagree with you. You have named one building, which is hardly enough for the support of a super league. Here are some numbers for you to consider.

European Hockey Arenas with capacity 10,000+

Andorra (0)

Armenia (0)

Austria (0)

Azerbaijan (0)

Belarus (0)

Belgium (0)

Bosnia and Herzegovina (0)

Bulgaria (0)

Belarus (0)

Croatia (0)

Czech Republic (1)

Team: HC Sparta Praha
Arena: T-Mobile Arena
Capacity: 14,660

Denmark (0)

Estonia (0)

Finland (2)

Team: Jokerit Helsinki
Arena: Hartwall Arena
Capacity: 13,665

Team: TPS Turku
Arena: Elysee Arena
Capacity: 11,820 (9,042 seated)

France (0)

Germany (3)

Team: Kolner Haie
Arena: Kolnarena (the one you make reference to)
Capacity: 18,500 (16,200 seated)

Team: Hamburg Freezers
Arena: Color Line Arena
Capacity: 13,886

Team: Dusseldorfer EG
Arena: Stadion an der Brehmstrasse
Capacity: 10,280

Greece (0)

Hungary (1)

Team: shared by three teams
Arena: Kisstadion
Capacity: 15,000

Iceland (0)

Ireland (0)

Israel (0)

Italy (0)

Kazakhstan (0)

Latvia (0)

Liechtenstein (0)

Lithuania (0)

Luxembourg (0)

Macedonia (0)

Malta (0)

Netherlands (0)

Norway (0)

Poland (0)

Portugal (0)

Romania (0)

Russia (0)

Serbia and Montenegro (0)

Slovakia (0)

Slovenia (0)

Spain (0)

Sweden (2)

Team: Djurgardens IF
Arena: Stockholm Globe Arena
Capacity: 13,850

Team: Vastra Frolund Indians HC
Arena: Scandinavium
Capacity: 12,192

Switzerland (2)

Team: SC Bern
Arena: Eisstadion Allmend
Capacity: 16,771

Team: ZSC Lions
Arena: Hallenstadion
Capacity: 11,500

Turkey (0)

Ukraine (0)

United Kingdom (1)

Team: Manchester Phoenix
Arena: Evening News Arena
Capacity: 17,500

Source: eurohockey.net

As you can see there have been some arenas constructed that are bigger than your average European building, but they are still small in comparison to NHL buildings. In fact, both Winnipeg and Quebec would be large market buildings, ones that were proven to be incapable of supporting the salary demands of NHL players.

Would you care to offer up a little more proof or would you prefer to retract your erroneous statement? Back to you kind lady.

Milano, Forum - capacity 11,000
Rome - capacity 13,000

 

[RyanMac]

I hope Europe does start their own super league.. It would be better for the game of hockey if there was competing pro leagues.. Just look at football with the EPL, Serie A etc.. It would be great for the international development of the sport..

 

[Riddarn]

Milano, Forum - capacity 11,000
Rome - capacity 13,000

They must be building a decent arena in Torino as well or am I wrong?

 

[Pepper]

The reason it has never worked in Europe is a lack of 3 things. Infrastructure, well that is gone, heck even Manchester England has an NHL size arena now. 2. TV, thanks to the lockout the european TV contracts are becoming very lucrative, in some circles they are saying there deals are better than the NHL national TV deal in the States. 3. Owners that financially did not compare to NA owners, that has radically changed, most of the owners that we are talking about are far wealthier than the current NHL owners.

You're so full of factual mistakes that I don't know where to begin...

Infrastructure is still a huge problem, there's only 2-3 modern 16.000+ arenas in Europe at the moment.

TV contracts are NOT lucrative if you compare it to NHL contracts, not even close (when you factor in all local & national contracts).

There are very few billionaire owners, in fact I'm aware of only one (Abrahamovich). I have never heard of this swiss billionaire. Btw, current NHL owners include guys like Melnyk, Anschultz, Wal-Mart owners, Disney, Cablevision, Comcast etc. You can bet your ass that European owners don't compare to them, again not even near.

Hockey is popular in maybe 5 European countries, 3 of those countries don't have the combined population of Canada.

Sorry but the chances of this superleague competiting with NHL is close to zero.

 

[RorschachWJK]

You're wrong. The main reason it doesn't work is because fans don't give a crap about teams from other countries, except when it comes to national team play which is a whole another deal. It has been proven again and again.

My thoughts exactly.