Proposal: Erik Karlsson for Bo Horvat

[AvatarAang]

You are mentally ill.

Says the guy who compared Kapanen to Mason Raymond

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

Says the guy who compared Kapanen to Mason Raymond

They both have speed.

 

[AvatarAang]

They both have speed.

Kapanen and Ovechkin both shoot right.

Do you see how dumb that argument is? Just because two players can skate fast doesn't mean they are good comparisons.

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

Kapanen and Ovechkin both shoot right.

Do you see how dumb that argument is? Just because two players can skate fast doesn't mean they are good comparisons.

Maybe, he was just comparing their speed, nothing else.

 

[AvatarAang]

Maybe, he was just comparing their speed, nothing else.

No, he said why would Dallas trade Honka for Kapanen when they could just sign Mason Raymond for free. And he called Kapanen the 2018 version of Mason Raymond.

Thankfully I'm starting to see some smarter canuck fans on these forums that aren't blinded by homer goggles like he is.

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

No, he said why would Dallas trade Honka for Kapanen when they could just sign Mason Raymond for free. And he called Kapanen the 2018 version of Mason Raymond.

Thankfully I'm starting to see some smarter canuck fans on these forums that aren't blinded by homer goggles like he is.

Yeah, that was dumb. Obviously, he has very shallow knowledge of Toronto and Vancouver hockey.

 

[Keeben]

Just accept the fact that he wont get traded and is going to walk away for nothing. Any trade wont make ott fans happy because his value to the league just doesn't match his skill. hes a top 3 dman in the league, just no teams going to pay that price.

teams are not trading for one year (practically a rental) of a player who has visually regressed this season and has possible injury concerns.

its in his best interest to go into the market where he can demand a kings ransom by a signing team.

 

[harrisb]

Just accept the fact that he wont get traded and is going to walk away for nothing. Any trade wont make ott fans happy because his value to the league just doesn't match his skill. hes a top 3 dman in the league, just no teams going to pay that price.

teams are not trading for one year (practically a rental) of a player who has visually regressed this season and has possible injury concerns.

its in his best interest to go into the market where he can demand a kings ransom by a signing team.

He didn't regress....
Had a bad start to the season after major reconstructive surgery, no training in the summer, missing training camp plus missing the beginning of the season. He then ended up with 62pts in 71 games which was 6 behind the defensive leader. He put up those numbers while playing 11 less games and getting back into game shape and learning to skate on a new foot. Players that only hold out for training camp never achieve those numbers let alone the other factors and that he played on a terrible team.

 

[GoodbyeLuongo]

Horvat is part of a team that couldn't make the playoffs. Not saying he's the problem (he's actually pretty decent, just overrated when people call him a #1C), but he's not part of the solution (or else the Canucks wouldn't be so bad). Nylander has been able to help his team make the playoffs every year he's been on the team.

Switch the two players and the team results are literally no different

 

[GoodbyeLuongo]

All I did was post replying to Canadian Canuck who stated that Horvat is a #1C when he clearly is not. I don't see how some criticism for one of your players is a bad thing.

Then I replied to dim Jim who said he couldn't think of any reasons why the Canucks would do this trade (lol).

I don't see an issue with any of my posts.

Oh conveniently forgetting the posts about the finals, the Canucks being terrible etc. It’s okay, we’ve come to expect most of your posts are troll posts

 

[Scott Stevens]

Pssst

 

[terry01]

Loving this thread! sub'dhttp://:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:/buluhidung/35/o.png

 

[member 105785]

I hear John Scott is a really nice guy too. Guess you’d rather him on your team over Karlsson as well?

Trading a 35 year old 4th liner for a generational dman on a 1 year deal is very different than trading a low end 1C/high end 2C who's 23 and very important to his team for a dman on a 1 year deal

 

[Siludin]

Karlsson's awesome, but this would only happen if the Canucks signed Tavares or something.

 

[Siludin]

Toronto = Playoffs

Vancouver = basement garbage

Use your brain.

I don’t give a **** about Vancouver, in fact I hate them with a passion. I no longer care to continue any conversation about them or you pissing on the Leafs. Ignored

I think there is a problem with discourse on this forum when a person proclaims their bias as a point in the argument, then refuses to continue the dialogue.

 

[Siludin]

how is this not locked yet? what a terrible proposal for Karlsson

Why would they add if the deal makes their team worse?

 

[Zats Muccarello]

EK isn’t being moved for anything less than 2 1sts, a blue chip prospect and a younger roster player.

Horvat is definitely a solid player with huge upside but the value is way off.

 

[WHISTLERNATE]

Canucks would take this deal and run away laughing. Ek will get a huge haul if he gets dealt, likely 3 prime assets. No way Horvat alone gets it done.

With that said, I would bet that most people here bagging on Horvat as a 50 point fringe 2nd line centre haven't watched him play much. He has legit 30 goal/70 point potential in his prime, while playing a strong 2 way game. He just put up a 28/28 pace while playing on one of the least talented teams in the league. I fully expect him to turn some heads with Team Canada at the WHC this year. He will be a huge piece of the Canucks core as get more competitive in the next couple of seasons.

 

[Icebreakers]

EK isn’t being moved for anything less than 2 1sts, a blue chip prospect and a younger roster player.

Horvat is definitely a solid player with huge upside but the value is way off.

Not if hes going to be a pending UFA. Especially if Karlsson is going to a shit team like Vancouver in his prime, no way he will re-sign.

Look in the history of trades, players dont return nearly as much as you think.

A unsigned Karlsson will get a good prospect and a first plus a young roster player max.

 

[Icebreakers]

Classy thread.

Attack neutral fan who does not share your valuation.

Attack players on neutral fans team to retaliate.

Complain that fans of neutral team participate in thread.

Priceless.

Back to the OP

There is no sense in making any trade proposals with Ottawa unless you work under the assumption Karlsson is extended for 8 years to yield maximum value because most HF Sens fans do not see any reality where they move him any other way.

If you were viewing Karlsson as a 1 year rental Horvat is more than fair value, but of course that is a risky move from Vancouver's point of view and they in turn would not trade Horvat unless they were keeping the player.

Horvat, a 1rst and your best prospect is probably a more realistic starting point in that scenario.

Horvat , a 6th overall pick and Elias Pettersson is worth more than a signed Karlsson, let alone an unsigned Karlsson.

 

[McVespa99]

As a canuck fan id do this value wise but the canucks arent in a position to make this type of deal

Yah they are. Because if nothing else they could flip Karlsson for waaaaaay more than Horvat

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Straight up

Not even close the #1 best D man in the league for Horvat, Any other team out there could beat this offer.

 

[SensNation613]

What is the guarantee he stays there?

Horvat has 1c upside, especially with how many players have come out of nowhere in their development.

Nobody has any idea if Karlsson would even stay in Vancouver, so potential 1C v a generational defender coming off of a very severe injury who can walk in one year? It really depends on your mindset, if you knew you could lock up Karlsson, it's a great deal for the Nucks, but if you have any doubt beyond 25% that he will walk, why gamble?

I think it's debatable. He's an excellent player but I just don't think he'll become a game changer. Yes, Canucks lack centre depth. Yes, Boeser has great chemistry with Bo. Yes, he's probably your future captain.

Here's the counter to all these points. If you acquired Karlsson, you can now make Tanev expendable and package him for a center. That center probably won't be as good as Horvat but having an adequate 2C and Karlsson is better for your team. Boeser benefits from EK more than Bo because Karlsson is a literal breakout machine and plays over 25 minutes a game.

Because it's the difference between a good player and an elite superstar. In addition, when making a trade for a superstar, you usually get the opportunity to speak to that player. Yes, there is the Vanek example but it is an outlier. Players can do a sign & trade or trade & sign. If EK makes it clear that he will not sign with you, you don't make the move but you'll obviously get the opportunity to speak to him. I think trades involving significant assets often work under this pre-requisite. Here's a list of trade examples and none of them were as talented as Erik Karlsson.

Examples:
Kyle Turris (OTT -> NSH), Frederik Andersen (ANA -> TOR), Phil Kessel (BOS -> TOR), Marian Hossa (OTT -> ATL), Alex Burrows (VAN -> OTT) and others.

 

[Scott Stevens]

Says the guy who compared Kapanen to Mason Raymond

You’re right. One guy carved out a decent nhl career. The other has 10 points in 55 games. Where does the lineup start to get that gem?

 

[4thlineduster]

Trading a 35 year old 4th liner for a generational dman on a 1 year deal is very different than trading a low end 1C/high end 2C who's 23 and very important to his team for a dman on a 1 year deal

I was getting at the fact the poster I quoted was going on a tangent Horvat is the better player to have because he’s a nice guy