Value of: Eric Staal

[AKL]

not even close. Do you even check things before you po







Staal(C) 33yo

2016-17 28g 37a 65pts.

2017-18 42 g, 33a 76 pts.

Nash(LW) 33yo

2016-17 23g, 15a 28 pts.

2017-18 21g 13a 34 pts.

And if I told you one was making more than twice as much as the other, you'd have never guessed which one it was.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Well yeah, to offset the fact that Nash was making 7.8M in a season where he had less than .5ppg up to that point and NY not retaining salary.

Nope. Bruins were paying Belesky $3.8M AAV for the next 2.5 years to play in the minors. Rags took him on as a favor to Boston and their cap crunch and that's why they got Spooner and Lindgren.

not even close. Do you even check things before you po

Staal(C) 33yo

2016-17 28g 37a 65pts.

2017-18 42 g, 33a 76 pts.

Nash(LW) 33yo

2016-17 23g, 15a 28 pts.

2017-18 21g 13a 34 pts.

Look staals a better player im not arguing that. didn't do much these past playoffs....his value at the deadline will be close to Nashs this year.

 

[AKL]

Nope. Bruins were paying Belesky $3.8M AAV for the next 2.5 years to play in the minors. Rags took him on as a favor to Boston and their cap crunch and that's why they got Spooner and Lindgren.

Yes, because Nash was making 7.8M and Boston couldn't afford it so they needed to send cap back. Exactly. There are no favors in the NHL. Boston made an offer for Nash, and New York did what they had to do to make the deal happen. They didn't do Boston a favor out of the goodness of their hearts.

It doesn't change the fact that at this point Staal is a significantly better player than Nash and assuming circumstances stay largely the same next year, Staal will have more value at the deadline. Not to mention the Wild won't have to take back an anchor contract to make a deal work.

P.S. Staal actually scored twice as much in his 5 games as Nash did, so

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Yes, because Nash was making 7.8M and Boston couldn't afford it so they needed to send cap back. Exactly. There are no favors in the NHL. Boston made an offer for Nash, and New York did what they had to do to make the deal happen. They didn't do Boston a favor out of the goodness of their hearts.

Y0u're making this too difficult. Someone said the return for Nash was greater than what Staal would supposedly fetch. My point was the return for Nash wsnsn't just a return for Nash, it was for Nash and also taking on one of the worst contracts in the league.

If and why the Rags had to take that on is irrelevant. Not only did it allow Boston to fit Nash under their cap, it also gives them some nice cap flexibility for the next 2 years. Again, hence the larger return.

Nash's contract is expiriing after this year, Belesky's does not. Nash's 'bad cap hit' does not offset Belesky being having 2 more years and playing in the minors taking up dead cap space.

 

[57special]

No , you are making no sense, whatsoever. You state that Staal and Nash will have the same value this offseason, when nothing could be further from the truth. Even if Staal has a 25% reduction in production he will be a bargain at 3.5M. If Nash has a 25% reduction in production then he will have little value, if any.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

It's a pipe dream. Considering the "Consider it a housewarming gift from Poile to Fenton" line, I didn't think it would be taken as seriously as you clearly took it.

But if you do consider what Rick Nash got last year, it's not as far off as you make it seem. Staal this previous season had more goals and as many assists as Nash had points. And Nashville's pick will likely be 27-31 which I get the feeling you're severely overrating the value of.

Rangers also took back a cap dump, and Nash a is "one of the big 2-way playoff warriors" kinda guys that GMs eat up. Plus it was an overpayment, I wouldn't expect that to precedent any deals.

But seriously, what forward rental has been dealt at the deadline for more than a 1st+?

 

[The Moose is Loose]

So GMs will be scared to trade for him because two years ago he was horribly misused? Did these last two year just not happen then?

Yeah its something they consider. He didn't show up at all when they needed him. Frankly he hasn't for the wild either. All 3 of his last playoffs have been extremely lackluster

 

[AKL]

Rangers also took back a cap dump, and Nash a is "one of the big 2-way playoff warriors" kinda guys that GMs eat up. Plus it was an overpayment, I wouldn't expect that to precedent any deals.

But seriously, what forward rental has been dealt at the deadline for more than a 1st+?

1) Again, the Rangers had to take a cap dump to make it work, it wasn't a "hey we'll sweeten it a little bit if you also take our cap dump". It was a part of the total deal that needed to happen in order for the trade to go through. You think New York would have taken a cap dump if Nash was making 3.5M? Absolutely not.

2) Staal is a much better player overall than Nash is, in all three zones, and he's a C. You ask when the last time a forward has been dealt for more than a 1st+? Well when was the last time a 30-40+ goal scoring C on a 3.5M contract was traded at the deadline? I'm not saying he should return Fiala+1st necessarily, but if next year he puts up similar numbers and a lot of teams are looking for help at the deadline, the bid will get up there pretty quickly.

 

[57special]

Nash is still a good defensive player, I think. As good as Staal. Maybe a tad better.

 

[AKL]

Yeah its something they consider. He didn't show up at all when they needed him. Frankly he hasn't for the wild either. All 3 of his last playoffs have been extremely lackluster

Nash hasn't had a good season in 4 years and hasn't had a good playoff showing in about the same time. Yet Nash is one of "those big 2-way playoff warriors that GMs love?" Don't give me that man. If Nash is a high level target at the deadline, Staal will be higher level. They've both had their troubles in the last 5 years, but Staal has done a much better job of redeeming himself. And you can't even give Nash the playoff edge, cause like I said, he's sucked in the playoffs for three years too!

 

[57special]

Rangers also took back a cap dump, and Nash a is "one of the big 2-way playoff warriors" kinda guys that GMs eat up. Plus it was an overpayment, I wouldn't expect that to precedent any deals.

But seriously, what forward rental has been dealt at the deadline for more than a 1st+?

Hanzal.

 

[Canes]

The Hurricanes need a number 1 center.

I'm sure Faulk wants to go home as well.

 

[AKL]

The Hurricanes need a number 1 center.

I'm sure Faulk wants to go home as well.

Well since it is the off-season, he should be able to visit quite a bit before he returns to Carolina in the fall.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Hanzal.

That was a 1st+ deal. Im confused

 

[AKL]

That was a 1st+ deal. Im confused

Yeah, you asked which rental player has been dealt for more than a 1st. He answered. Hanzal was dealt for more than a 1st as a rental at the deadline.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Nash hasn't had a good season in 4 years and hasn't had a good playoff showing in about the same time. Yet Nash is one of "those big 2-way playoff warriors that GMs love?" Don't give me that man. If Nash is a high level target at the deadline, Staal will be higher level. They've both had their troubles in the last 5 years, but Staal has done a much better job of redeeming himself. And you can't even give Nash the playoff edge, cause like I said, he's sucked in the playoffs for three years too!

Think whatever you want man, I should have known when you wanted Fiala and a 1st for a rental that you weren't even worth talking to about it. Fiala is a former 1st rounder progressing very well, and a 1st? f***ing crazy.

I don't think Staal will return that much. Every single year fans talk about how much their rentals were going to be worth. Remember when leafs fans wanted 2 1sts for JVR? Regardless, every fan has these huge expectations, and then every damn year they are wrong and their top 6 rental forward goes for a 1st round pick. Don't complain when it happens again this coming year.

And like I said, the Nash trade was stupid and they overpaid (really the only big overpayment this deadline), and still the outline of the deal was a 1st+

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Yeah, you asked which rental player has been dealt for more than a 1st. He answered. Hanzal was dealt for more than a 1st as a rental at the deadline.

No he was dealt for a 1st+, like I said. Don't change my wording.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Rangers also took back a cap dump, and Nash a is "one of the big 2-way playoff warriors" kinda guys that GMs eat up. Plus it was an overpayment, I wouldn't expect that to precedent any deals.

But seriously, what forward rental has been dealt at the deadline for more than a 1st+?

Are you talking 2 1sts? What do you mean by “more than a 1st+”?

 

[Canes]

Well since it is the off-season, he should be able to visit quite a bit before he returns to Carolina in the fall.

Are you trying to tell me you wouldn't want a Faulk package from Carolina? Faulk would be a great add to Iowa for you guys.

 

[AKL]

Are you talking 2 1sts? What do you mean by “more than a 1st+”?

Apparently a 1st+ and more than a 1st are two different things.

 

[AKL]

Think whatever you want man, I should have known when you wanted Fiala and a 1st for a rental that you weren't even worth talking to about it. Fiala is a former 1st rounder progressing very well, and a 1st? ****ing crazy.

I don't think Staal will return that much. Every single year fans talk about how much their rentals were going to be worth. Remember when leafs fans wanted 2 1sts for JVR? Regardless, every fan has these huge expectations, and then every damn year they are wrong and their top 6 rental forward goes for a 1st round pick. Don't complain when it happens again this coming year.

And like I said, the Nash trade was stupid and they overpaid (really the only big overpayment this deadline), and still the outline of the deal was a 1st+

Again, when was the last time a 40 goal, 75 point C was traded at the deadline. Quality of player matters in these deals. Usually at the deadline , the guys traded are 40-50 point players, and they still get 1st+. Even if the 40 goal, 75 point player is on his last year, he's still more valuable than a 50 point guy on his last year.

And again, it depends on the market. If a lot of teams are looking to add an Eric Staal for a Cup run, you can expect the bidding to go up fast.

It's a really simple concept. Is it guaranteed to happen? No. Could it happen? Absolutely. Will it be Fiala+1st? Probably not. Could it be a prospect similar to Fiala? Absolutely. Just look at Fiala's teammate, Forsberg, and how he landed on the Predators: For Martin Erat of all people at the deadline.

 

[FrodoBeggins]

Coburn to make salary work + Joseph + Stephens + Raddysh? I doubt that’s enough but Staal would be wonderful in Tampa.

Coburn to make salary work + Cal Foote + Joseph + Raddysh?

 

[bluedevil58]

Carolina 2018 1st and Zykov. Would do Hanafan if the contract was longer.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Coburn to make salary work + Cal Foote + Joseph + Raddysh?

I doubt yzerman bites, he wouldn’t move Foote in a Karlsson deal

 

[57special]

Coburn to make salary work + Cal Foote + Joseph + Raddysh?

That's a lot of good prospects from TBL. Foote, plus any one of those two, and Walker(7th rounder), and I'd be more than happy...

Staal has been great in MN, but they(and he) have to face the fact that a Cup is probably not going to happen during his tenure there. Sucks for him, as he really likes MN, but hey, losing sucks, and people get fired. Staals low cap hit and short term makes him easy to move. The ultimate TDL acquisition. I think MN should move him during the summer, it they are going to move him at all. His mid season move didn't work well at all, but NYR seemed to go out of their way to make it fail.

Does TBL even need Staal, though?