Edmonton Vs Toronto (Defence)

Best group of Defencemen?


  • Total voters
    141
Status
Not open for further replies.

North Cole

♧ Lem
Jan 22, 2017
11,346
12,581
Hmm not sure. Ill break it down to 4 different sections and see if that tells us anything.

1. Goals against: main job of defense is to prevent goals.
2. Shots against. Less shots equal less chance of goals against.
3. Shot maps: from where on the ice are shots allowed? This can give a good picture of defensive ability, generally you would want the shots allowed to be mainly far from and to the perimeters of the goal.
4. Goalies, last line of defense and most important defensive player of the ice.

Section 1: Goals against
Toronto 202
Edmonton 227

Clear advantage going to toronto, the whole point of defense is to let in less goals in this simplified form.

Section 2: Shots against (per game)
Toronto 34.1
Edmonton 32.0

Advantage edmonton, less shots against means less chance for a goal scored against.

Section 3: Shot maps
Toronto
TOR

5v5

TOR

Pk
------------------------------------------------------------
Edmonton
EDM

5v5
EDM

Pk

Clear advantage: toronto. Leafs do let up alot of shots from the slot but other than than that most of the shots allowed are far from goal. Meanwhile edmonton defense seem to be cut and most shots are taken in prime position near the goal.

Section 4: Goalies
Toronto: Andersen: 58gp 33w 1955 SA .919% 2.79 GAA

Edmonton: Talbot: 57gp 26w 1736 SA .908 2.98 GAA

Advantage: Toronto slight advantage . My reasoning here is that yes andersen easily post better numbers with higher amount of shots faces, but... his team infront of him seems to be alot better at keeping the puck further from him so i would presume he is facing alot less high quality shots than talbot. Otherwise i would have put a much bigger advantage.


Conclusion
Torontos defense is handily better in my opinion judging from these sections. 2 negatives are the high amount of shots (which might not even be that negative as a miss is also a opportunity to gain possesion) and the high amount of shots in the high slot. Other than that it looks solid, especially conparing to edmonton.

Thanks for you time.

Lol, those shot maps are a wash...
EDM's pk map looks the chest of a guy that comes into the ER with nine gun shot wounds.
TOR 5v5 map isn't any better...if you wanted to send mail to the big red blob, the address is "123 shelf street, goal town".

Talbot is a less expensive Scott darling this year. Andersen is playin average. More shots is definitely not a good thing. You'll find that out in the playoffs....

This is a pointless debate tbh. It's like two one-legged men arguing, one with a right leg and the other with a left leg..
Left-legged guy - "we both have one leg, you idiot..."
Right-legged guy - "nah, the right is my dominant leg, so i can still kick".
*insert gif of him trying to play soccer*
 

Brobust

Registered User
Sep 29, 2017
6,866
6,299
Good call on Dermott. Having 2nd round picks develope the way Dermott did is an ideal way to build a winning hockey team in the cap world.

73% GF in the NHL. Playing at a 30 point pace without PP time.
 

Raging Bull

Present
Jan 25, 2004
20,087
4,849
Hamilton, ONT
Ya of course. Its only November. Remember the year after the Boston collapse you guys started really good and started collapsing in the new year? Maybe if it was February or March id be scared but nah i still expect the collapse.

This is why I try to avoid posting in absolutes on here. There is a collapse going on for sure though.
 
  • Like
Reactions: garyturner3

zeke

The Dube Abides
Mar 14, 2005
66,937
36,957
Lol, those shot maps are a wash...
EDM's pk map looks the chest of a guy that comes into the ER with nine gun shot wounds.
TOR 5v5 map isn't any better...if you wanted to send mail to the big red blob, the address is "123 shelf street, goal town".

Talbot is a less expensive Scott darling this year. Andersen is playin average. More shots is definitely not a good thing. You'll find that out in the playoffs....

This is a pointless debate tbh. It's like two one-legged men arguing, one with a right leg and the other with a left leg..
Left-legged guy - "we both have one leg, you idiot..."
Right-legged guy - "nah, the right is my dominant leg, so i can still kick".
*insert gif of him trying to play soccer*

but one of those one legged men is 12th in GA/gm while being one of the top scoring units in hockey.
 

Narow

Registered User
Nov 11, 2016
5,927
706
Lol, those shot maps are a wash...
EDM's pk map looks the chest of a guy that comes into the ER with nine gun shot wounds.
TOR 5v5 map isn't any better...if you wanted to send mail to the big red blob, the address is "123 shelf street, goal town".

Talbot is a less expensive Scott darling this year. Andersen is playin average. More shots is definitely not a good thing. You'll find that out in the playoffs....

This is a pointless debate tbh. It's like two one-legged men arguing, one with a right leg and the other with a left leg..
Left-legged guy - "we both have one leg, you idiot..."
Right-legged guy - "nah, the right is my dominant leg, so i can still kick".
*insert gif of him trying to play soccer*
Perhaps...id advice you to check my comment again if you think i was arguing that letting up more shots as a positive.

Besides it doesnt matter if you deem the differences to be insignificant or not the question was which defense is better and i tried to be analyctical and come up with a answer and at this point that is my conclusion.

I do think you are selling andersen short with the type of workload and types of shots he is facing...he is still putting up great numbers in my opinion.
 

Raging Bull

Present
Jan 25, 2004
20,087
4,849
Hamilton, ONT
Klefbom was playing injured the entire season, Nurse is blossomung into a #1 D, and Sekera is starting to return to his old form. With the emergence of Bear, I'd take the Oilers'

Bear is starting like 66% of the time in the offensive zone and is playing on the powerplay, has he really been that impressive?
 

DatSnipeMatthews

Registered User
Oct 5, 2017
1,427
1,152
Canada
Klefbom is the best defenseman on both teams having a poor start to the season. Nurse has been our best defenseman this year but is still #4 on the healthy depth chart and would also be 4 on the Leafs.. Leafs have a solid group of 3 in Rielly, Zaitsev and Gardiner and a drop off after that.

Oilers,
LOL. Nice try! Rielly and Gardiner are head and shoulders better than Kelfbom.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DriveFor9th

North Cole

♧ Lem
Jan 22, 2017
11,346
12,581
Perhaps...id advice you to check my comment again if you think i was arguing that letting up more shots as a positive.

Besides it doesnt matter if you deem the differences to be insignificant or not the question was which defense is better and i tried to be analyctical and come up with a answer and at this point that is my conclusion.

I do think you are selling andersen short with the type of workload and types of shots he is facing...he is still putting up great numbers in my opinion.

Andersen is doing fine, I wouldn't rank him in the top 5 or 6 but he is getting the job done. I don't think I'm selling him short at all. Talbot in Toronto results in an additional 21.86 GA, yes Talbot has been that bad. Goaltending is a large part of it. Toronto also has much better special teams deployment.

You said, "Which might not even be that negative due to"...possession change? Too many shots and their locations are negatives and trying to mitigate it so it wouldn't seem as bad, thus helping your argument, doesn't really work.

EDM has a worse than average Defence that does nothing to help its offence, which is par for the course because the offence does nothing when McDavid isn't on the ice - possession or otherwise. Tor has an average defence that helps its offence and has a team that can play infront of it, followed by better coaching systems.

but one of those one legged men is 12th in GA/gm while being one of the top scoring units in hockey.

Exactly, and there in lies the difference. EDM has Mcdavid and Draisaitl, followed by literally no one else. TOR has three foward lines that can drive possession, better coaching staff, and a better culture. EDM D doesn't contribute anything to the offense and is sometimes a tire fire on Defence. TOR reminds me of Pittsburgh last year - giving up boat loads of shots and it was okay, because Murray and Fleury showed up when they needed to and the Pens score anytime they need a goal.

EDM took a huge step back defensively and TOR took a step forward, I have no issues admitting this; however, you can be 12GA/g all you want. The playoffs is primarily played at EV strength, and if that red cloud isn't fixed in the slot and goal tending takes any regression, it's going to be a big mountain to climb.

Having said all that, I'm prepared for - "at least my team is making the playoffs, you guys are bums". I remember when the Oilers made the playoffs every year in the early 2000's, and every year we went out to Dallas or Detroit in the first round. I sincerely hope that doesn't happen to you guys. Also, this thread bump was classic, "I have an axe to grind, let's rub it in". I'm not going to keep feeding this shit, so reply whatever you want. I'll read it but I'm done posting here. Thanks for the discussion.
FTR - people that are saying Hainsey is close to Larsson are lost, as Willy would say to them - GOOD DAY SIR.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->