ECQF: (2) Boston Bruins vs (3) Toronto Maple Leafs | Boston Leads Series 2-0 (Mod Warning #2718)

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Fossy21

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Mar 14, 2013
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Lol what? He's 2 years older. Matthews had more goals than Pastrnak had points his first 2 years.

LOL yeah, because you are comparing players 2 years apart. Cute. Try again next year when you can compare Matthews 2018-2019 to Pastrnak's 2016-2017. :laugh:

He's one year older. He came into the league at 18, Matthews at 19.
 
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FerrisRox

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Sep 17, 2003
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While I completely I agree with this I'll also accept that Boston't top line and D do a lot of the work and create a situation where Pasta can just play his game and doesn't have to fight so hard to get the puck and move it forward.

I think its rather disingenuous to give Boston's top line and D all the credit for the time and space that Pasta has out there. The lion's share of the credit should be going to Mike Babcock who has come up with a game plan where the Maple Leaf defense doesn't go anywhere near him on the ice and players simply glide when he has the puck rather than moving their feet.

Because of that coaching choice, Pasta has a ridiculous amount of time and room to do whatever he wants out there.
 
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Vancouver Canucks

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I think its rather disingenuous to give Boston's top line and D all the credit for the time and space that Pasta has out there. The lion's share of the credit should be going to Mike Babcock who has come up with a game plan where the Maple Leaf defense doesn't go anywhere near him on the ice and players simply glide when he has the puck rather than moving their feet.

Because of that coaching choice, Pasta has a ridiculous amount of time and room to do whatever he wants out there.

Clearly, Babcock likes pasta.
 

Fossy21

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Mar 14, 2013
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I mean context is important, Pasta is third wheeling with Bergeron and Marchand, while Matthews is literally the go to guy on Toronto.

Plus Pasta is in his d+4 while Matthews is in his D+2.... I mean it's an easy choice for me.



He is a third wheel, Bergeron and Marchand are simply better players -- I mean no disrespect but it is what it is.

Pasta is in his d+4, Matthews is in his d+2 -- if Matthews was playing with players like Marchand and Bergeron, and Pasta was playing with Hyman and Nylander... I really don't think the point totals would be close. But you guys are free to think whatever you like.

He'd also be on a line that's expected to shut down the other teams' top offensive threats, not on a line that's kept away from other shutdown lines and defensive zone starts. That's mitigated by their amazing possession game, but still a factor.

An argument to be made for Matthews is he played roughly a minute less on the PP per game, and scored a higher ratio of even strength points. This series will play a factor in a comparison as well. Auston needs to turn it on.

Matthews probably is and likely will be the better player. Then again, we had Leafs fans telling us Marchand is nowhere near Matthews's level (even at this point), so arguing Pasta over Matthews isn't quite as farfetched as that.
 
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Fossy21

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Just throwing in my two cents here.. In professional sports a 1 year difference in age is huge when talking about late teens/early 20's. Definitely not "practically the same". There are plenty of studies to support this.

The difference isn't typically as big for generational talents, though. Guys like that are expected to step into the league and deliver as a first liner in the first year and as a Hart candidate within 2-3. Crosby had his best scoring season in his sophomore year, he was the same age as Matthews was his rookie year. Of course you have exceptions even in that high-end, Thornton and the Sedins being some examples.

LOL. Your GM sure wouldn't. I've seen some whacky arguments on here but this is next level.

Pastrnak's contract is pretty good as well, and that's a factor. Matthews will be an RFA after next season, we'll see what contract he gets then and maybe reconsider. :)

No its because we kicked the **** out of you this year. ALSO I think Marchand is overrated and overpaid. I also though Chara was done. I also saw you as a one trick pony with no depth. I do suspect a little bit of what we are seeing is Toronto losing not so much Boston Winning. I firmly suspect Boston was in Toronto's head, or we were so worried about tampa we lost sight of the fact that Boston is a good team.

I do not believe that Boston is as good as their record says. I also don't think Toronto is for real yet. We are too weak on D. I would much rather trade my second for Plek, go for it just to have our asses kicked because if we get stomped, the glaring defiances shown can be addressed much more than the 2nd round pick we gave up. In the end, if we get stomped by Boston, it could be the thing of everyones Nightmares in the next few years.

In a post full of hilarious posts, this has to be the greatest. Calling Marchand at 6M overpaid should get anyone insta-banned from a hockey forum :laugh:
 
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dagatcho1986

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Oct 3, 2017
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Um...in the actual real world...they offered JVR (36 goals this season) and a 1st for Hamonic...they backed away when Snow wanted another pick. I am not sure what 2nd rounder for top 4D offer you are talking about.
at the trade deadline, Leafs offered a 2nd round pick for tanev...recognized he was injured at that time..he was already healthy towards the end of the season, but decided to shut him down to avoid further injuries as the guy gets hurt a lot due to style of play...the style of play that would give Andersen a chance...i think liljgeren and a 1st could have done it in my opinion
 

King Mapes

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He's one year older. He came into the league at 18, Matthews at 19.
I forgot Matthews just missed the cut to be drafted earlier. Still, though, a guy with 4 year experience should be better than a guy with 2. Like I said, both are great talents though and just enjoy them.
 

DrJustice

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Dec 1, 2014
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I forgot Matthews just missed the cut to be drafted earlier. Still, though, a guy with 4 year experience should be better than a guy with 2. Like I said, both are great talents though and just enjoy them.

Both players also made the decision to play against men in pro leagues before being drafted.

Seems it did a good job in preparing them to be able to produce in the league right away, Pasta needing a little more time than Matthews who was great right away.
 

Fossy21

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Mar 14, 2013
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I forgot Matthews just missed the cut to be drafted earlier. Still, though, a guy with 4 year experience should be better than a guy with 2. Like I said, both are great talents though and just enjoy them.

I agree. Generational guys usually excel at an early age compared to #25 picks, though. That's not to say Auston has peaked or anywhere near it, but you might see more of an improvement in defensive awareness than in goal scoring, for instance.
Also, Pastrnak had injury problems and played on 3rd and 2nd lines under a Claude Julien scheme his first two seasons, so it's not fair to compare those first year and second year (or even second year and third year to compensate for age) to Matthews's two years in the league. Hell, you'll never get a fair one for one comparison.
Since Cassidy took over, Pasta has scored 47-59-106 in 109 regular season games, plus 6-7-13 in 8 playoff games. Comparing is useless, but Boston's situation at centre and their first line's combined salary are both pretty damn good for them.

Both players also made the decision to play against men in pro leagues before being drafted.

Seems it did a good job in preparing them to be able to produce in the league right away, Pasta needing a little more time than Matthews who was great right away.

Pasta was great right away too. He wasn't getting the TOI and PPTOI (28 seconds of PP time per game in 2015-16 compared to 3:05 this year) and had a worse average quality of line mates than Matthews (obviously much better now, though). He was kind of at the stage DeBrusk or Heinen are right now. Hope they can break out like that too, though they're slightly younger or slightly older than Pasta respectively and won't exactly fit on the first line anytime soon. :laugh:
 

King Mapes

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I agree. Generational guys usually excel at an early age compared to #25 picks, though. That's not to say Auston has peaked or anywhere near it, but you might see more of an improvement in defensive awareness than in goal scoring, for instance.
Also, Pastrnak had injury problems and played on 3rd and 2nd lines under a Claude Julien scheme his first two seasons, so it's not fair to compare those first year and second year (or even second year and third year to compensate for age) to Matthews's two years in the league. Hell, you'll never get a fair one for one comparison.
Since Cassidy took over, Pasta has scored 47-59-106 in 109 regular season games, plus 6-7-13 in 8 playoff games. Comparing is useless, but Boston's situation at centre and their first line's combined salary are both pretty damn good for them.



Pasta was great right away too. He wasn't getting the TOI and PPTOI (28 seconds of PP time per game in 2015-16 compared to 3:05 this year) and had a worse average quality of line mates than Matthews (obviously much better now, though). He was kind of at the stage DeBrusk or Heinen are right now. Hope they can break out like that too, though they're slightly younger or slightly older than Pasta respectively and won't exactly fit on the first line anytime soon. :laugh:

I get what you're saying but my main beef was comparing them strictly on the last 2 years since one at least had some experience. That's silly. Comparing them in their age 19-20 seasons is more fair. Pastrnak had some NHL experience and Matthews got minutes right away based on draft position. But even then, let's compare them in 5 years.
 

Fossy21

Nobel Prize Deke
Mar 14, 2013
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I get what you're saying but my main beef was comparing them strictly on the last 2 years since one at least had some experience. That's silly. Comparing them in their age 19-20 seasons is more fair. Pastrnak had some NHL experience and Matthews got minutes right away based on draft position. But even then, let's compare them in 5 years.

Agreed.
 
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Mikeshane

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Jan 15, 2013
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I hope Toronto see that LA vs Vegas game because that's the kind of effort they need to have.
 

Fossy21

Nobel Prize Deke
Mar 14, 2013
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I hope Toronto see that LA vs Vegas game because that's the kind of effort they need to have.

I hope Andersen/McElhinney see Quick's effort on the Neal goal and emulate that. With how great Quick has been, that's backbreaking and heartbreaking.
 
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razkaz

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Oct 3, 2013
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Ouch. Game 2 and the sting became worse. Not taking anything away from Boston, they are playing lights out and firing on all cynlinders (with injuries to boot), meanwhile the Leafs just aren't competing. Watched the game on Saturday and saw no drive from our top 3.

Game 3 is going to be huge if the Leafs want any hope to make this into a series everyone was expecting.

Also congrats on Pastrnak for his achievements Saturday night, he is just oozing with confidence.

Go Leafs Go!

Edit: correct spelling of Pastrnak, will be referring to him as Pasta since I can't screw that up :thumbu:
 
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Leaf Fans

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Sep 29, 2017
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I'm curious whether most Leaf fans wanted their GM to do more at the trade deadline.
Sure, just didn't want to give anyone up to get someone. Teams just don't give away players regardless of how great we think we are. So Plexiglass isnt working out the way we would have liked,but it was the best move we could make.
 

Liferleafer

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at the trade deadline, Leafs offered a 2nd round pick for tanev...recognized he was injured at that time..he was already healthy towards the end of the season, but decided to shut him down to avoid further injuries as the guy gets hurt a lot due to style of play...the style of play that would give Andersen a chance...i think liljgeren and a 1st could have done it in my opinion
Lol...Liljegren and a 1st....
 
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