E.J or J.J ?
- Thread starter atreides
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Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
As much as I like Jack Johnson, I can't ignore Erik Johnson's potential. He's quite a bit bigger than Jack and almost as good a skater. Throw in his shot and other abilities, and we could be looking at a very special player.
Frankly, I think Erik Johnson is everything Jack Johnson was hyped to be. JJ is a great prospect but to me he doesn't show the signs of fulfilling the hype machine surrounding him. EJ does, from what I've been able to see to date.
Matt, I disagree about JJ. He's been utterly dominating at Michigan... I think he's fulfilling that hype.
As for this thread, I'd take EJ, but just slightly. His size is what does it for me.
One question, though; is he as nasty as JJ? That's something I love about his game.
As for this thread, I'd take EJ, but just slightly. His size is what does it for me.
One question, though; is he as nasty as JJ? That's something I love about his game.
reidy said:
I don't think he's going to fulfill the hype around his pro potential, I should have been more clear.
After seeing them both at the WJCs, and how they're performing, I can't give Jack the edge anymore, Eric is a year younger, and at a better point in his development, his speed is intimidating, devastating point shot, and a frame, that if he was to completely fill it out, you're looking at a player in the mold of a Chris Pronger, whereas Jack might be more of a Chris Chelios type.
If I'm thinking long term, and I can afford to wait a couple years, I put my money on Eric, he's just got what Jack has, plus.
If I'm thinking long term, and I can afford to wait a couple years, I put my money on Eric, he's just got what Jack has, plus.
It's going to be fun watching the US defense corps. in the Olympics in a few years, though. Both Johnsons, Suter, Whitney, and I'm probably forgetting some other studs.
If only we had the goaltending to go with it.
If only we had the goaltending to go with it.
Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
reidy said:
We do: Ryan Miller. I also think it's too early to write off Rick DiPietro. There's also highly regarded guys like Jim Howard coming down the pike.
I like both Johnsons a whole lot, but Erik to me has better physical tools. His mobility is as good as Jack's, but his size and frame are superiour. Erik's potential has no ceiling I can see. He has no physical limitations. His long stride makes him deceptively fast, and he already looks fast; his quickness, agility, footspeed, and lateral mobility are all excellent, and for a guy of his size they are nothing short of amazing; he has a great shot and very good puck skills; he can't be beaten 1 on 1; basically, his combination of size/strength/mobility/skill are unmatched. Jack does have a very nice aggressive mean streak to him that Erik might not have, and he makes better decisions and is less error prone, but Erik is only 17 and that part of his game can improve.
I am not trying to put down EJ as he is a future gopher and i can hardly wait to see him in maroon and gold. And this is not a super boost to JJ either. But EJ is playing USNTP and had a very good tourney. Turned lots of heads and jumped up the depth chart. Another gopher did the exact same thing. Phil Kessel. With a strong tourney and a dominating performance in the u18s. If Kessel was eligable last year he would have gone number 2 no doubt and if not for Crosby, he would have been a number one for sure. But now in the NCAA there are second guessers. And i feel he has been just what i exepted. And should not be knocked off that number one spot.
So i think EJ is a tad over hyped. He will struggle a bit in the WCHA next year. Just like any freshman. There will be doubters and second guessers. Those who realize he is a freshman will see that he is playing extremly well and way ahead of his years.
Now JJ. Yes he is playing really well. But IMHO the CCHA is a second tier conference now a days. With Hockey East and the WCHA ahead of them. MI was outscored by CC, the Gophers and WI, by 15 6 and in those games JJ was not so hot. So he is having his typical freshamn struggles as well. Taking some dumb penalties and so on. But if you take a dumb penalty, make it an aggresive one. And he is doing that. I would not tell him to tone it down at all. And he has shown that he is holding his own if not owning others while playing D. For a freshman having a tremedous campaign.
I think EJ has the the higher ceiling. He is just to perfect a D man. Size, speed and shot. But right now JJ is doing it against better competion. I know the USNTP plays agaist college teams. But those are exebitions. And most college teams are not as up for those games and usually feature bench players to keep them fresh and back up goalies. With the main goal to get out of the game healthy.
So i think EJ is a tad over hyped. He will struggle a bit in the WCHA next year. Just like any freshman. There will be doubters and second guessers. Those who realize he is a freshman will see that he is playing extremly well and way ahead of his years.
Now JJ. Yes he is playing really well. But IMHO the CCHA is a second tier conference now a days. With Hockey East and the WCHA ahead of them. MI was outscored by CC, the Gophers and WI, by 15 6 and in those games JJ was not so hot. So he is having his typical freshamn struggles as well. Taking some dumb penalties and so on. But if you take a dumb penalty, make it an aggresive one. And he is doing that. I would not tell him to tone it down at all. And he has shown that he is holding his own if not owning others while playing D. For a freshman having a tremedous campaign.
I think EJ has the the higher ceiling. He is just to perfect a D man. Size, speed and shot. But right now JJ is doing it against better competion. I know the USNTP plays agaist college teams. But those are exebitions. And most college teams are not as up for those games and usually feature bench players to keep them fresh and back up goalies. With the main goal to get out of the game healthy.
I can't say much about Erik Johnson but I like Jack's mean streak and his consistent physical play. My vote goes to JJ but that's only because of my ignorence at this point.
Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
McRanger said:
I like Montoya, buy I'd like to see a bit more out of him at the pro level before anointing him as some kind of USA Hockey savior.
MN_Gopher said:
vs. Minnesota, JJ had no points and was a +1. He was on ice for two goals (one PP) and not on the ice for any goals against.
vs. Wisconsin, JJ had an assist and was -1. He and Hunwick got split on Wisconsin's GWG (only goal against he was on the ice for).
vs. Colorado College, JJ did not play. Neither did Kevin Porter, Mark Mitera, and Andrew Cogliano due to the World Juniors, and David Rohlfs due to a game suspension. It was known WELL ahead of time that missing five regulars equaled doom against a high-caliber team like CC.
Not really what I'd call "not so hot" for JJ in those games. Jack's still averaging a point per game as a freshman defenseman and a +7 rating, which, despite Michigan's struggles the past month, is still impressive. Add to that the bullseye he carries on his back for his aggressive play (i.e. the "excessive roughness to the head" game-DQ he received against Michigan State in what should have been no more than a charging call). He still has work to do (when to/not to pinch), but no freshman is perfect.
Erik Johnson's getting a ton of hype right now, but it was no different for Jack last year. You're right that most colleges don't put forth a major effort against the U18 team, so it's hard to judge them by those games. Some people thought Phil Kessel would come in this season and put up 90 points as a freshman a la Kariya, but he's nowhere close to that (that doesn't mean he's playing bad, just expectations were way out of whack). We'll get a better idea of Erik next season when he's playing against more equal competition.
And while we're jumping from Johnson to Johnson, there's another defenseman named Eric Johnson ('91) coming up that might be joining the U17 team next year who's said to be very physical. Must be something with that last name
KH1
Registered User
Jack Johnson without much question. The Ducks are going to rue the day they took Bobby Ryan instead--JJ has all of the skills you could ask for and is only getting better.
No offense to Erik but I would be flat out stunned if Jack doesn't become a top 10 defender in the NHL.
No offense to Erik but I would be flat out stunned if Jack doesn't become a top 10 defender in the NHL.
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