Pre-Game Talk: Ducks vs Jets - Fri Mar 23 7:00pm CT

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Ducky10

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Fact is, Wheeler is the PP quarterback. Often when Buff has the option to pass to Laine, he knows Laine won't shoot it if he does because he won't be in a prime position to shoot it.

I'm surprised other people haven't caught on, but literally the only time the puck is sent towards Laine is to shoot it, or if things are scramble and they're trying to regain control.

Buff isn't looking to see if Laine is open enough to receive a pass. Buff is looking to see if Laine is open enough to take a high quality shot. This is the key thing here, and why buff doesn't pass to Laine as much even if he's open to receive a pass. Even if Laine gets the puck from buff, he'll be closed down too quickly to do anything useful with it. That's why Buff just sends it right back to Wheeler. Same thing for behind the goal line. Stastny will rarely cycle it around to Laine, it goes right back to Wheeler.

One of the times you will see buff look for Laine immediately is if they win the draw clean. That's when Laine is most open and Laine has scored a few of his goals mere seconds into the powerplay due to that set play.

But ya, it's not that Buff can't see Laine open, they're basically sticking with the plan to have Wheeler playmake from the right wall. It's gotten them the 2nd best PP in the league so makes complete sense.
Well said, completely agree. I never could understand where people got the idea Buff wouldn't pass to Laine, is incapable of making a good pass to Laine or just doesn't see him. He's just not doing it if it's not the best opportunity, unlike the Caps who just feed Ovi the puck for him to pump at the net in volume.

The most curious part of the PP to me has always been Wheeler being a RHS on the right half wall. I think it must make some sense for what the are trying to do down low and into the bumper spot and I guess it does help Wheeler get off a few more shots that have less chance of getting blocked. It's different though but it sure has worked so what the hell do I know. Just keep it going.
 

surixon

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Looking forward to this one.

Good discussion on the PP and I agree with the majority in that it flows through Wheeler.

On to 3 on 3 OT, I have been thinking a bit lately and I think the reason that Wheeler and Buff have decreased effectiveness is due to the evolution of the style of play. Back when 3 on 3 was instituted it was far more chaotic and teams where happy to trade chances and counter attack. That really suited a player like Wheeler's game as he is a very direct north south player that thrives on fast breaks and counter attacks.
Today teams don't tend to try to trade chances, they opt instead to control the puck and slow play the situation. Both the offense and defense are trying to wait each other out. The offense is looking for the mistake that gives them the perfect chance and the defense is looking for the mistake that gives them the puck/odd man break. The slow build part doesn't really agree with Wheeler's mentality on offense and as such you often see the Jets rush up the ice quickly with Wheeler and try to force a chance as witnessed last night and on countless other occasions this season. With Buff its a matter of risk management. Maurice touched on this in his presser last night when he stated they where working on managing risk better. He specifically referenced 50/50 plays that look great the times they work but burn you when they don't. We have all seen Buff get burned in OT this year going for that high risk high reward play. Neither of those traits are conclusive of the patience/puck management styles that are now being regularly employed in OT these days. I get Maurice's hands are somewhat tied with those two being some of his biggest impact players but they really don't approach OT the way the successful teams approach it now.

We have a number of players who exhibit those traits in Connor, Chef, JoMo, Ehlers, Laine etc who are superior options based on how they think and approach the game.

I have no issue with Maurice playing his vets in OT but they can't be the go to guys or play half of the OT. It would also help if he separated Wheeler and Buff and had each play with two patient east/west puck managers.
 

CaptainChef

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That has been me the past couple of weeks. Buff apparently either doesn't have good peripheral vision or is sticking to the plan. Either the plan does not include a pass from Buff to Laine or he just doesn't see it. Many times lately he has forced a pass to Wheeler while Laine is wide open and ready.

I don't believe in any conspiracy theories and I hope this doesn't open the door for that type of discussion, but the fact is that Laine has been very obviously open and Buff either doesn't see it or has been coached to pass to wheeler.
I've noticed that too, but my take on Buff not doing the pass to Laine is that everyone including the goalie would be quite prepared for a Laine shot in that instance, whereas a pass to Wheeler allows him to choose one of many setup options including the cross-ice pass to Laine which gives the goalie & defence little time to setup.
Edit - I see JimmyJ & others beat me to this take on the PP setup
 
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Howard Chuck

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I've noticed that too, but my take on Buff not doing the pass to Laine is that everyone including the goalie would be quite prepared for a Laine shot in that instance, whereas a pass to Wheeler allows him to choose one of many setup options including the cross-ice pass to Laine which gives the goalie & defence little time to setup.
Edit - I see JimmyJ & others beat me to this take on the PP setup
I understand what everyone is saying and normally this all makes sense for pretty much every player in the league. But I think laine is the exception. If he’s open and has even a bit of room he has the best chance of scoring. I agree that almost everyone else in hockey requires the element of surprise or an extremely quick pass to beat a goalie, but I think if Laine has the puck and a little bit of room, he has the best chance at scoring.

I want to be clear that I’m not saying this is how it should work all the time, just now that the pp is struggling and only when it is painfully obvious that Laine is all alone and Wheeler has little room.
 
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JetsWillFly4Ever

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Well said, completely agree. I never could understand where people got the idea Buff wouldn't pass to Laine, is incapable of making a good pass to Laine or just doesn't see him. He's just not doing it if it's not the best opportunity, unlike the Caps who just feed Ovi the puck for him to pump at the net in volume.

The most curious part of the PP to me has always been Wheeler being a RHS on the right half wall. I think it must make some sense for what the are trying to do down low and into the bumper spot and I guess it does help Wheeler get off a few more shots that have less chance of getting blocked. It's different though but it sure has worked so what the hell do I know. Just keep it going.
I was always curious about wheeler being a RHS on that side as well. It always made more sense to me that it would be a left handed shot who could see more of the ice and have more of a threat of a one timer or something of that ilk. Obviously it has worked incredibly well so I have no complaints about the system as is.

I think what him being a RHS allows, is that he can make the pass down low a lot easier as his stick won't be on the inside, he can dig pucks off the board easier as he will be on his forehand, and he can get the shot off easier when the defenders are cheating toward the pass. I also think it opens up the cross ice pass to Laine better as it changes the angle of the pass so that it's coming backwards a bit rather than straight across, because his stick will usually be a bit deeper into the offensive end as a right handed shot.
 
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Oilpeg

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I was always curious about wheeler being a RHS on that side as well. It always made more sense to me that it would be a left handed shot who could see more of the ice and have more of a threat of a one timer or something of that ilk. Obviously it has worked incredibly well so I have no complaints about the system as is.

I think what him being a RHS allows, is that he can make the pass down low a lot easier as his stick won't be on the inside, he can dig pucks off the board easier as he will be on his forehand, and he can get the shot off easier when the defenders are cheating toward the pass. I also think it opens up the cross ice pass to Laine better as it changes the angle of the pass so that it's coming backwards a bit rather than straight across, because his stick will usually be a bit deeper into the offensive end as a right handed shot.

I think Wheeler being in that position is more indicative of the player than the handedness. Wheeler is their best play maker, therefore he gets the half-wall spot. His handedness is irrelevant to him getting that spot. It does open things up as you've described nicely in your post, the backward angle of the pass from a righty to a righty cross ice is an interesting observation too, hadn't thought of that one. Not sure how much impact that has as a PKer should be adjusting to the angle whichever way it's laid out. What Laine does exceptionally well is move, he doesn't remain stationary and depend on the threaded pass, he'll drift higher or lower depending on the defender, which keeps that defender's head spinning allowing Wheeler to catch him off-guard when he passes.

As for the Buff not passing to Laine purposely, that's just silly. Nobody is looking off anyone for any reason but strategy at this level. Buff is a very good player, if he's not making the pass to Laine in whatever situation, it's because he sees a better option. I trust his judgment as to what the better play is. It's been laid out by myself and others that the pass from Buff to Laine is too short to get the goalie moving, therefore, the run through Wheeler. Yes, Laine may be able to beat a goalie anyway but the percentages are higher if the pass is from further.

Another thing to consider is how much the PKers key on Laine, drift that forward high to his spot. If Buff forced those passes over to him constantly, the PP becomes predictable and easier to defend. By going to the Wheeler side, it provides the most options and loosens the box because PKers are going to try and prevent all his options, which is impossible. Even if Laine is open for Buff, it still makes more sense to lull the PKers into positions you want them in instead of looking for a quick strike. Personally, I hate when Wheeler shoots from his spot, but it's really a necessary play because it proves it's possible he'll shoot, once again forcing the PKers to be aware of that as well.

All in all, the Jets PP is very good and it's at the top of the standings for a reason. To the suggestion of putting the left shooting Morrissey or Chiarot up there, it doesnt work on PP1 because of Wheeler, but it would work with PP2 and Ehlers, something definitely worth a try. I don't particularly like Myers decision making from up there, so another option would be nice. Having Chiarot pound away with that cannon is a really interesting idea, blows my mind that we're even talking about Ben Chiarot on the power play, but he's been good.
 
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Jets 31

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Was watching the ducks and flames last night , pretty boring hockey . The Ducks are a fairly big team but man the Jets can skate circles around these guys , you can't hit what you can't see . Just have Buff and Lowry out against perry and i can grow lots of hair on my face but absolutely none on my head Getzlaf . :laugh:
 
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Aavco Cup

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Was watching the ducks and flames last night , pretty boring hockey . The Ducks are a fairly big team but man the Jets can skate circles around these guys , you can't hit what you can't see . Just have Buff and Lowry out against perry and i can grow lots of hair on my face but absolutely none on my head Getzlaf . :laugh:

Ducks had 16SOG and scored 4
 
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surixon

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I think Wheeler being in that position is more indicative of the player than the handedness. Wheeler is their best play maker, therefore he gets the half-wall spot. His handedness is irrelevant to him getting that spot. It does open things up as you've described nicely in your post, the backward angle of the pass from a righty to a righty cross ice is an interesting observation too, hadn't thought of that one. Not sure how much impact that has as a PKer should be adjusting to the angle whichever way it's laid out. What Laine does exceptionally well is move, he doesn't remain stationary and depend on the threaded pass, he'll drift higher or lower depending on the defender, which keeps that defender's head spinning allowing Wheeler to catch him off-guard when he passes.

As for the Buff not passing to Laine purposely, that's just silly. Nobody is looking off anyone for any reason but strategy at this level. Buff is a very good player, if he's not making the pass to Laine in whatever situation, it's because he sees a better option. I trust his judgment as to what the better play is. It's been laid out by myself and others that the pass from Buff to Laine is too short to get the goalie moving, therefore, the run through Wheeler. Yes, Laine may be able to beat a goalie anyway but the percentages are higher if the pass is from further.

Another thing to consider is how much the PKers key on Laine, drift that forward high to his spot. If Buff forced those passes over to him constantly, the PP becomes predictable and easier to defend. By going to the Wheeler side, it provides the most options and loosens the box because PKers are going to try and prevent all his options, which is impossible. Even if Laine is open for Buff, it still makes more sense to lull the PKers into positions you want them in instead of looking for a quick strike. Personally, I hate when Wheeler shoots from his spot, but it's really a necessary play because it proves it's possible he'll shoot, once again forcing the PKers to be aware of that as well.

All in all, the Jets PP is very good and it's at the top of the standings for a reason. To the suggestion of putting the left shooting Morrissey or Chiarot up there, it doesnt work on PP1 because of Wheeler, but it would work with PP2 and Ehlers, something definitely worth a try. I don't particularly like Myers decision making from up there, so another option would be nice. Having Chiarot pound away with that cannon is a really interesting idea, blows my mind that we're even talking about Ben Chiarot on the power play, but he's been good.

Chariot doesn't move the puck near well enough to play on the PP. He also doesn't move with the puck well enough to open his shot. He would be shut down pretty easily. It takes more than just a hard shot to be good in that role.

Morrissey is the optimal player for that spot as he can shoot and pass at a high level and his reads are smart and quick.
 
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SM17

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Sick? Injured?......he did take pre-game warm up vs the Kings or.....

Is he going to be returned to the Moose?

Yeah could be anything really. I thought though that if he went back to the Moose he couldn’t be recalled again? I don’t understand much about that side of the NHL but think I remember someone mentioning that?
 

Aavco Cup

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Yeah could be anything really. I thought though that if he went back to the Moose he couldn’t be recalled again? I don’t understand much about that side of the NHL but think I remember someone mentioning that?

The Jets have used 3 callups. They are allowed 4. These are regular callups. There is no restriction on emergency callups.
 

Jack722

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Looking forward to this one.

Good discussion on the PP and I agree with the majority in that it flows through Wheeler.

On to 3 on 3 OT, I have been thinking a bit lately and I think the reason that Wheeler and Buff have decreased effectiveness is due to the evolution of the style of play. Back when 3 on 3 was instituted it was far more chaotic and teams where happy to trade chances and counter attack. That really suited a player like Wheeler's game as he is a very direct north south player that thrives on fast breaks and counter attacks.

Nice analysis. I also think Buff isn't particularly well suited to 3-3 with his style of play; his value is being a big body with great awareness/offensive instincts, who can effectively join the offense 5v5, but neither of those things really have the same effectiveness in 3 on 3... Buff joining the offense is basically expected so it has very little positional 'surprise' value, and plus then you're left 3 on 3 with a forward covering on defense.
 
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