Doughty Hit on Carrier (UPD: Suspended One Game)

Sol

Smile
Jun 30, 2017
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Four questionable hits, sure. Four worse than his? Kadri, yes.Wilson and Johansen, maybe but getting an angle on those at this point for me has been troublesome, the Anderson board I don't know if it was worse but five and a game that early on is a pretty hefty price to pay that I would say is on par with Doughty's punishment since Doughty didn't get called at all. I totally get his frustration though. The consistency with which the league doles out punishment is absolutely a problem. I don't like the idea of going with player opinion in the moment or even in general on stuff like this because the health affects that go with it should mean that it gets more consideration than that.



You ain't hurting my feelings, bud but keep on projecting. You do you.

The fact you're still here as a "neutral" party making a myriad of bogus claims that aren't based in reality ; all the while the teams in question have nothing to do with yours.

Your position makes no sense in reality.

If mental gymnastics was an Olympic sport, you'd take gold consistently. No doubt.
 

Pinkfloyd

Registered User
Oct 29, 2006
70,181
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Folsom
The left shoulder of Anderson is back, the first point of contact and principal point of contact is the head. Anderson is still lean forward at this point in time, he is not moving in a backwards motion as a result of body contact first.

Again they are not consistent, nobody really knows the rule at this point




tom-wilson-hit-960x480.jpg

That's not really a clear shot of him picking the head though from my perspective. And I don't think it's clear where the point of contact is and whether or not there is more body contact. Wennberg gets sandwiched here which muddies it up. However, if it was determined that he did pick the head, Wilson should be suspended longer than Doughty. I just don't see the evidence that shows that to be true.
 

Pinkfloyd

Registered User
Oct 29, 2006
70,181
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Folsom
The fact you're still here as a "neutral" party making a myriad of bogus claims that aren't based in reality ; all the while the teams in question have nothing to do with yours.

Your position makes no sense in reality.

If mental gymnastics was an Olympic sport, you'd take gold consistently. No doubt.

Just because you're incapable of understanding doesn't mean it makes no sense or is bogus. It just means you don't understand. It's okay.
 

paragon

Registered User
May 5, 2010
1,726
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Neutral fan.

Hate this call, it's borderline, you don't suspend superstars who don't have some immense history for borderline hits. Especially when Carrier was going at him all game.
Player status should have zero bearing on how suspendable actions are whether they are at the receiving or giving end.
 

fsanford

Registered User
Jul 4, 2009
7,496
2,874
That's not really a clear shot of him picking the head though from my perspective. And I don't think it's clear where the point of contact is and whether or not there is more body contact. Wennberg gets sandwiched here which muddies it up. However, if it was determined that he did pick the head, Wilson should be suspended longer than Doughty. I just don't see the evidence that shows that to be true.

Man, I want you on a jury if I was ever accused of murder, and they had a video of me with a gun to a guys head, suddenly there is a truck that passes between camera and the event.
After the truck passes by guy is on the ground dead, shot in the back not the head. You would keep me from the rope ;)
 

Zybalto

Registered User
Dec 28, 2012
9,481
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Its official. DOPS are now mind readers whose powers seem to grow when faced with public pressure.

Bad news for the game of hockey.

Really have no idea why this is a game and some of the other similar hits dont even get looked at. Scandalous really.
 

Kingspiracy

Registered User
Nov 13, 2006
6,318
2,416
I think someone needs to come up with an app for determining suspensions. Have all the players vote yes or no on each case that gets referred, policing the game themselves. Then you could have hockey fans make up 5% of the vote. It would probably be more consistent than the current rulings.
 

Kyndig

Registered User
Jan 3, 2012
5,147
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I'm not big on conspiracy theories but it's hard to help for me to think this was partly because the league wants Vegas to succeed.

I have a hard time seeing how this is 1 game when you take the playoffs into consideration and hes arguably the best defenseman in the league (which lets face it they take that into consideration on their suspensions)...yet the hit on Antipin got 0 games in the regular season when it was by someone with previous history. :huh:

Vegas being in the playoffs as an expansion team was already fishy enough and this suspension doesn't really help things. Hoping LA turns it around and wins the series so I don't have to keep hearing about Vegas.
 
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mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,277
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The left shoulder of Wennberg is back, the first point of contact and principal point of contact is the head. Wennberg is still lean forward at this point in time, he is not moving in a backwards motion as a result of body contact first.

Again they are not consistent, nobody really knows the rule at this point

I wonder though had the Caps won, if the decision would have been different, I am leaning towards yes.


tom-wilson-hit-960x480.jpg

I wouldn't mind seeing Wilson suspended, but I'm not seeing conclusive evidence in that picture that Wennberg's head was the main point of contact.
 

FishMonger

Registered User
May 4, 2012
702
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Los Angeles, CA
That's not really a clear shot of him picking the head though from my perspective. And I don't think it's clear where the point of contact is and whether or not there is more body contact. Wennberg gets sandwiched here which muddies it up. However, if it was determined that he did pick the head, Wilson should be suspended longer than Doughty. I just don't see the evidence that shows that to be true.

This is just absurd. Up until this point I had hope that you'd be able to have a decent, honest conversation, but this is asinine, and proves otherwise.

Good day sir, or madam.
 

Zybalto

Registered User
Dec 28, 2012
9,481
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I wouldn't mind seeing Wilson suspended, but I'm not seeing conclusive evidence in that picture that Wennberg's head was the main point of contact.

So, exactly like Doughtys hit then except Wilson left his feet and is a repeat offender?

I still cant understand this suspension.
 
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Raccoon Jesus

Todd McLellan is an inside agent
Oct 30, 2008
61,373
60,649
I.E.


Even Blake saying "we'll stick by our player there."

That's as diplomatic a 'f*** you' as you'll get from respectful guys.

Glad Drew verbalized himself well too, thought he might have just gone full racoon-in-a-dumpster give no f***s mode but that was well said and pretty much my feelings exactly.
 

Pinkfloyd

Registered User
Oct 29, 2006
70,181
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Folsom
Admission by silence.

Yeah I don't think so but keep trying.

This is just absurd. Up until this point I had hope that you'd be able to have a decent, honest conversation, but this is asinine, and proves otherwise.

Good day sir, or madam.

I am not the only one who shares that opinion. I don't give a damn about Tom Wilson and would throw the book at him whenever he commits an infraction deserving of such but I just don't see the conclusive evidence like mouser above has stated. That still is leaving a lot out of the picture for what you're trying to get there. I don't disagree that DoPS is painfully inconsistent with their punishments. I don't disagree that that very play could be suspension-worthy if another angle shows a much clearer view of where the contact is on Wennberg. Like I said, if that angle showed that he picked the head, then he deserves a suspension and longer than Doughty because Wilson has history and because of him leaving the ice to make that hit.
 

Zybalto

Registered User
Dec 28, 2012
9,481
8,753
The Doughty video clearly shows Carrier's head was the main point of contact.

Really dont like the sound of "main" point of contact. Kind of a slippery slope word. Not saying this happened in any of the cases but it further muddies intent which is the most important yet ignored variable. Initial was flawed as well but at least it lets you know what you hit first.

Wilsons hit is a leave yer feet hit em in the head hit. Pretty obvious intent.

Doughtys is a "he clipped the shoulder and then hit the head so we're gonna say he intended to hit the head" mind reading mess.

No one should be celebrating this media driven suspension.
 
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mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,277
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South Mountain
Really dont like the sound of "main" point of contact. Kind of a slippery slope word. Not saying this happened in any of the cases but it further muddies intent which is the most important yet ignored variable. Initial was flawed as well but at least it lets you know what you hit first.

Wilsons hit is a leave yer feet hit em in the head hit. Pretty obvious intent.

Doughtys is a "he clipped the shoulder and then hit the head so we're gonna say he intended to hit the head" mind reading mess.

No one should be celebrating this media driven suspension.

Well, "main point of contact" is the language in the rule book, so the most logically word to apply.

In contrast, Intent is not part of the rule. The NHL deliberately removed intent from the Illegal Check to the Head rule four years ago because it was difficult to assess intent. Just like high sticking or delay of game for playing the puck out of bounds, intent doesn't matter.

Now the DoPS can assess intent as part of determining suspension length. However establishing intent is not required to suspend a player. And frankly, imo most suspensions are for actions that weren't intentional, more commonly they're mistakes/dumb/reckless plays with outcomes the player didn't intend.
 

FishMonger

Registered User
May 4, 2012
702
17
Los Angeles, CA
Yeah I don't think so but keep trying.



I am not the only one who shares that opinion. I don't give a damn about Tom Wilson and would throw the book at him whenever he commits an infraction deserving of such but I just don't see the conclusive evidence like mouser above has stated. That still is leaving a lot out of the picture for what you're trying to get there. I don't disagree that DoPS is painfully inconsistent with their punishments. I don't disagree that that very play could be suspension-worthy if another angle shows a much clearer view of where the contact is on Wennberg. Like I said, if that angle showed that he picked the head, then he deserves a suspension and longer than Doughty because Wilson has history and because of him leaving the ice to make that hit.

I SAID GOOD DAY, SIR
 

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