Confirmed with Link: Does anyone care about Dzingel signing? (He did. 2 yrs, 1.8 AAV post #106)

[danielpalfredsson]

The first year of the deal is a steal if he puts up 30+ points again.

The second year of the deal is likely a steal as well considering he will be in his 3rd year in the NHL, and right in his prime. I expect him to be a 40 point player by then, at least.

Good deal all things considered. Just my 2 cents.

I wouldn't be so certain. It's a possibility, but there is a lot of risk. Dzingel was a 4th liner or worse production wise for a good chunk of last season. He basically stopped producing for the last 30 games.

With what he's shown, I'd say it's a toss up over what kind of player we're going to get which is why I wouldn't be surprised if this contract isn't intended to get one more cheap year out of Dzingel with the intention of possibly shipping him out in year 2 if he doesn't do enough in 17-18 to make the Senators confident that he is worth 2.1M.

 

[Jorge Garcia]

I'm glad to see DZ back. I think he's going to settle in the middle 6 as a 20G, 40 pt. guy. He has world-class speed, decent hands and -- I think -- pretty good hockey sense and playmaking skills. And I don't think he has a terminal case of lack of finish. When he's missed chances, it's been off the bar, off the post, very near misses -- not Condra-style sad fails. With the number of chances he gets, the law of averages says he'll score more than he has in the past. I think Sens paid a premium for the sake of team harmony, and I'm OK with that.

 

[Sensinitis]

I wouldn't be so certain. It's a possibility, but there is a lot of risk. Dzingel was a 4th liner or worse production wise for a good chunk of last season. He basically stopped producing for the last 30 games.

With what he's shown, I'd say it's a toss up over what kind of player we're going to get which is why I wouldn't be surprised if this contract isn't intended to get one more cheap year out of Dzingel with the intention of possibly shipping him out in year 2 if he doesn't do enough in 17-18 to make the Senators confident that he is worth 2.1M.

He dropped off a cliff after about 50 games. I think that's normal for a relatively skinny player used to the AHL number of games and university hockey (about 40 games). The NHL is a whole other beast. He got worned down and it showed, I don`t see why he can't be a 40 pt player with his skillset and all the breakaways he missed.

Agreed for the bolded, that's very possible if he stagnates.

 

[JungleBeat]

He dropped off a cliff after about 50 games. I think that's normal for a relatively skinny player used to the AHL number of games and university hockey (about 40 games).

That shouldn't really be an issue anymore since he's three years away from college and played and excess of 65+ games the last three seasons.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

More than I expected although I think he shows promise and I like his potential.

just an FYI .. If Don Meehan is his agent ... previously reported somewhere I believe

He also represents
Karlsson
Stone
Ryan
Phaneuf

http://ottawacitizen.com/sports/hockey/nhl/senatorsextra/dzingel-signed-a-two-year-3-6-million-contract-with-sens

There is, however, still the possibility that MacArthur could retire, which would put more pressure on Dzingel to produce.

“We hope Clarke comes back,†Dorion said. “All indications are along those lines, that he will come back, but, if he chooses to go another direction, we’ll respect that.â€

 

[Samsquanch]

Good deal. He can still definitely improve on last year. He hit a wall but who cares, he was one of our better forwards for the first 50 games (aka the majority of the season).

His speed is deadly, and you can bet your sweet ass that he's going to be spending the off season working on that muffin of a shot of his. I'm betting we see a noticeable improvement next year.

 

[Sensinitis]

That shouldn't really be an issue anymore since he's three years away from college and played and excess of 65+ games the last three seasons.

I generally agree, but nothing compares to the every day grind of the NHL.

I think he'll be better this season, and even better the next. Still an adjustment period.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Cap is currently 69,187 with 13 forwards and 6 D.

Add Chabot (863k) and we are over 70.

 

[Countdown0]

Seems like a good deal for Dzingel. Not costing us too much and not an overly difficult contract to move in a trade if need be.

What kind of comparable players to Dzingel are there, and what are they making? Assuming they aren't on their rookie deals, of course.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Seems like a good deal for Dzingel. Not costing us too much and not an overly difficult contract to move in a trade if need be.

What kind of comparable players to Dzingel are there, and what are they making? Assuming they aren't on their rookie deals, of course.

Ryan Dzingel=14 goals 32 points this season/111 career games/71 hits

AAV ABOVE DZINGEL
Zack Hymen 2.25Mx4 (this contract buys up 2 UFA years so that likely raises the cap hit. 28 points this past season. Similar NHL experience to Dzingel.)

Jersper Fast 1.85Mx3 (21 points in 68 games last year, 30 points the year before, significantly more NHL games than Dzingel at 200+.)

Zack Kassian 1.95Mx3 (Over 300 career games, big hitter/sand paper type player. 24 points last season)

Jonas Donskoi 1.9Mx2 (Only 17p in 61 games, but had 36 points the year before including a fantastic playoff. 130+ career games.)

Melker Karlsson 2Mx3 (Plays C which is a more coveted position. 11 goals/22P in 67 games. Almost 200 career games)

AAV BELOW DZINGEL

Michael Ferland 1.75Mx2 (15 goals/25 points. 173 career games, 150 hits this past season.)

Derek Ryan 1.45Mx1 (30 year old 1st year NHLer. 11 goals/29 points in 67 games.)

Brett Connolly 1.5Mx2 (15 goal season, nearly 300 NHL games. Technically was a pending UFA since he was not qualified but he was still under team control until July 1st. He signed before hand with his original team)

Brett Ritchie-1.75Mx2 (16 goals 24 points last year. 117 career games, big player with 150+ hits)

Oscar Lindberg 1.7Mx2 (Plays a higher paid position in C than Dzingel who is a winger, averages 30 points per 82 games the last two seasons, more career games @ 134)

Johan Larsson-1.475Mx2 (Pros 178 NHL games, Cons only 12 points in 36 games last year)

Make of those what you will.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

wow....I was expecting a max of 1.5 mil average.

Kid better bury his chances for the next two years.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Seems like a good deal for Dzingel. Not costing us too much and not an overly difficult contract to move in a trade if need be.

What kind of comparable players to Dzingel are there, and what are they making? Assuming they aren't on their rookie deals, of course.

Donskoi 25 2 x 1.9 AAV deal
2015-16 San Jose Sharks NHL 76 11 25 36
2016-17 San Jose Sharks NHL 61 6 11 17

Brent Ritchie 23 2 x 1.75 AAV
2016-17 Dallas Stars NHL 78 16 8 24

Sven Baertschi 24 2 x 1.85 AAV
2015-16 Vancouver Canucks NHL 69 15 13 28
2016-17 Vancouver Canucks NHL 68 18 17 35

Dzingel 25 2 x 1.8 AAV
2016-17 Ottawa Senators NHL 81 14 18 32

 

[Countdown0]

Thanks danielpalfredsson & Sens of Anarchy

Seems like Dzingel probably could have gotten 1.8 per from another team, so I wont complain.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

After looking at comparable contracts more closely, the AAV on a 2 year deal doesn't look as bad. Obviously is not a great contract or a steal. It's in the range of market value, maybe a bit high considering Dzingel's lack of NHL experience.

Although, I am still baffled why the Senators would settle this high if they truly felt 1M was a reasonable ask going into arbitration. Yes, teams usually ask slightly high or slightly low, but they also try not to go crazy and ask for absurd amounts as it hurts their case. This isn't exactly a criticism as much as it is something that comes off as peculiar to me.

This makes me think that losing the arbitration case wasn't an option for the Senators, and possibly budget wise it was really important to get Dzingel in below a certain number for the 16-17 season, which is why they might have been willing to risk overpaying Dzingel in 18-19 @ 2.1M to get him locked in at 1.5M this year. Worst case scenario, there's a reasonable chance a player with Dzingel's tools is tradeable if they can't keep him @ 2.1M in real salary come 18-19.

The big problem with Dzingel is that for the first half of the season he was a player who would easily exceed 1.5M and 2.1M in value but for the second half and playoffs which arguably are more important he was an unproductive 4th line winger. For Dzingel of the first 41 games, I think most people would be thrilled with this deal. Let's hope it turns out that way.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Cap is currently 69,187 with 13 forwards and 6 D.

Add Chabot (863k) and we are over 70.

And yet we have more than a few people saying ownership is holding us back....

 

[Boud]

For what it's worth after signing today Dzingel had an interview where he was saying that his goals for next season were to capitalize on more scoring chances (specifically breakaways) and also said that he'd like to have a better 2nd half. Last summer Dzingel was not a clear cut choice to make the roster and I remember him clearly saying that he was not only training to make the team, but he was training to make an impact on the team and again at that point he was 50/50 to make the team according to most of us.

I think Dzingel works extremely hard. I think he's passionate and he always takes criticism the right way, he works harder and knows his flaws. I'm pretty confident in Dzingel playing well throughout the year this time and again continuing to prove people wrong as he did for his entire career. He says the right things and he does the right things. Even when he got scratched in the playoffs they asked him to be more implicated physically and he came out flying. I don't think he'll ever be much more than a 40pt guy, a little like a Paul Byron was last year, but his commitment to the team and getting better is exemplary which leads me to believe he won't dissapoint this season.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

After looking at comparable contracts more closely, the AAV on a 2 year deal doesn't look as bad. Obviously is not a great contract or a steal. It's in the range of market value, maybe a bit high considering Dzingel's lack of NHL experience.

Although, I am still baffled why the Senators would settle this high if they truly felt 1M was a reasonable ask going into arbitration. Yes, teams usually ask slightly high or slightly low, but they also try not to go crazy and ask for absurd amounts as it hurts their case. This isn't exactly a criticism as much as it is something that comes off as peculiar to me.

This makes me think that losing the arbitration case wasn't an option for the Senators, and possibly budget wise it was really important to get Dzingel in below a certain number for the 16-17 season, which is why they might have been willing to risk overpaying Dzingel in 18-19 @ 2.1M to get him locked in at 1.5M this year. Worst case scenario, there's a reasonable chance a player with Dzingel's tools is tradeable if they can't keep him @ 2.1M in real salary come 18-19.

The big problem with Dzingel is that for the first half of the season he was a player who would easily exceed 1.5M and 2.1M in value but for the second half and playoffs which arguably are more important he was an unproductive 4th line winger. For Dzingel of the first 41 games, I think most people would be thrilled with this deal. Let's hope it turns out that way.

Didn't Dzingel paly in the top 6 in the first half of the season, and bottom 6 the rest of the way?

I don't think that 'first half' production is doable in the bottom 6 going forward (and oh man, I hope I'm wrong on that).

 

[Stylizer1]

And yet we have more than a few people saying ownership is holding us back....

Ownership really has no choice. It got to the point when people where losing faith (Murray era) that this team actually had a plan.

 

[Real Smart Sens Fan]

Ownership really has no choice. It got to the point when people where losing faith (Murray era) that this team actually had a plan.

Ahhhh, so you're responsible for all the progress that we've seen in the past 14 months or so since Murray stepped down.

 

[Sun God Nika]

1.8M is a ****ing steal for 15 goals.

 

[Qward]

Bobby Butler scores 10g in 36 games. Gets 2 years.
Colin Greening scores 6g in 24 games. gets 3 years.
Peter Regin 13g in 75 games. Gets 2 years.
Erik Condra 6g in 26 games. Gets 2 years.

Pretty much par for the course on guys that could be seconds liners but end falling down the ladder.

 

[Tuna99]

Ahhhh, so you're responsible for all the progress that we've seen in the past 14 months or so since Murray stepped down.

No one can pretend the Murray era was a success. The evidence is in, it was bad on all fronts, performance, player relationships, in game experience, attendance, ownership - the entire thing didn't go well.

Murrays peak was the Buffalo game when we got into the brawl and he and Ruff put on a show for the cameras. After that is was all downhill. He managed to marginalized every star player Ottawa had in that game.

 

[Micklebot]

Bobby Butler scores 10g in 36 games. Gets 2 years.
Colin Greening scores 6g in 24 games. gets 3 years.
Peter Regin 13g in 75 games. Gets 2 years.
Erik Condra 6g in 26 games. Gets 2 years.

Pretty much par for the course on guys that could be seconds liners but end falling down the ladder.

Not sure Condra was ever seen as a second liner option, and the other three all rode Spezza's coattails to get their contracts.

 

[missthenet]

People cared a lot more when they thought MacArthur was done.

Personally, I like what he brings, but I can see why some people are frustrated.

He's like Greening, in that he can play up and down the lineup, but fails to bury enough scoring chances and lacks overall offensive talent. Meanwhile his points will get him an inflated salary.

I am pretty sure Dzingel cares

 

[Xspyrit]

Bobby Butler scores 10g in 36 games. Gets 2 years.
Colin Greening scores 6g in 24 games. gets 3 years.
Peter Regin 13g in 75 games. Gets 2 years.
Erik Condra 6g in 26 games. Gets 2 years.

Pretty much par for the course on guys that could be seconds liners but end falling down the ladder.

Regin and Condra were excellent bottom-sixers for a time with a cap hit of 1.0 and 0.625. Those extensions were super cheap and well deserved. I doubt Condra was ever regarded as a possible top-6. Regin was probably projected as an excellent 2-way 3rd line center (a taller Pageau)

Greening had a promising debut but everybody got fooled by physical attributes and speed. I looked at his puck handling and knew he wouldn't work as a top-sixer. His first extension at $816,667 was really good, but unfortunately he carried his success jut long enough to earn another extension, and that's were it became a bad investment, something that was rectified with the Phaneuf trade.

Butler looked promising too (10 goals, 11 assists in 36 games) and Sens probably thought they would save by signing him to a one-way $1,050,000 contract for 2 years but that was a player that had a short life span. A cheap gamble that they lost. Not a big deal.

No one can pretend the Murray era was a success. The evidence is in, it was bad on all fronts, performance, player relationships, in game experience, attendance, ownership - the entire thing didn't go well.

Success is not the word I'd use but the team under Murray was far from being as bad as some claim

The team went through a rebuild and made the playoffs 5 time out of 9 seasons and went to the 2nd round once. In the regular season, Sens were 18th in terms of standing points; 13th for GF and 10th for GA.

Maybe the results were average but Murray built a solid foundation and a flourishing pipeline that put the team in a great position. It's clear that last year's team was mostly because of Murray's work, unless you think that Dorion's acquisitions (Brassard, Burrows, Stalberg, Pyatt, Kelly) made the difference

The big critic I always under Murray was the coaching staff, but maybe the budget didn't even allow him to get better.

Just the fact that you say "it was bad on all fronts" shows how unfair and totally unreliable your assessment is. Performance was both good and bad depending on the stretches, player relationships were mostly excellent, in game experience? Attendance was also good during that time for a small market, not sure what you're talking about :

http://www.espn.com/nhl/attendance

Murrays peak was the Buffalo game when we got into the brawl and he and Ruff put on a show for the cameras. After that is was all downhill. He managed to marginalized every star player Ottawa had in that game.

What is that? Apples and oranges? Why are you listing an event when he was coach now? Weird...

And he managed to marginalized every star player Ottawa had in that game? lmao what is that crap