Speculation: Do you think there is a riff between our GM and Coach?

[Jumptheshark]

Mods can merge this if they like if they believe that this is a redundant thread.

But after watching the last 2 weeks worth of games, I started asking myself about how the trades of Maroon and Letestu affect the teams play since the trades.

Since the deals the Oilers have gone I think 8-4 (ignoring overtime and shoot outs)--

We have talked and argued about how Tmac over used Letestu on the PP and a few other situations and gave Maroon lots of ice time as well.

There is scene in money ball and in the book where the GM and the Manager (Billy Beane and Art Howe) where Beane wants player X to play but Howe keeps playing player Y---one day Beane again tells Howe to play Player X and when Howe says no, Bean goes "Well, player Y now plays for another team." Howe has argued that discussion did not go that way.

But I am starting to think that Chia may have traded both Maroon and Letestu because Tmac was over using both and the harm of other players

this might just be me

Click to read more...

 

[PaPaDee]

Maybe, but both were UFAs, and it would have been silly for Chia not to try to get something for them.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I don't think McLellan wants to keep putting Lucic in a top 6 role ...

 

[oobga]

I can't see it with Maroon. That was just a UFA move. The Oilers probably would have extended him if the price was right, but Maroon wants to see if he can get a Clowe-like payday.

Letestu, for sure, McLellan was in love with the guy, and it was to the detriment of the team. That was a legit addition by subtraction move because of how McLellan was using Letestu.

McLellan bailing on trying Drai at C before the season even started was a good example of GM and coach being on a different page.

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

I think this is giving too much credit to Chiarelli. That said he was smart enough not to hurt our cap further by extending these players. I love the return for Letestu, but I think the return on Maroon was poor asset management.

 

[Mr Positive]

I don't think McLellan wants to keep putting Lucic in a top 6 role ...

well either McLellan is doing that to send a message to the GM that he needs to do something with the player, or both decided that after trading away Maroon they would give the McDavid-Lucic duo another try, and a real try over an extended period. As much as people hated it, the idea of getting him going is not awful if we aren't winning anyway, simply because we cannot afford to buy him out.

However, as far as I'm concerned, if you want to get Lucic going, create the situation that fits his playing style. He doesn't play the kind of game that McDavid does. McDavid is not a magical resource you use to get someone going. He can slump too.

And yes, yet again the answer imo is offense from the back end. It would solve many issues on this team, but unlocking Lucic's potential is one of them. He plays a territorial game, not a possession game or north-south game. As a net presence, he can be a positive contributor, but only if we combine that net presence with some quality shots from the point and some cycling ability. That would also fix our powerplay.

 

[lakai17]

You watch too much tv(perhaps). I think it's been a circus show with the lines all season long.

 

[rboomercat90]

I brought it up months before the Letestu trade that the only way to stop Mclellan from overusing him was for Chiarelli to move him out of here. I was thinking of that scene from Moneyball when I brought it up. It was clear he was a crutch for Mclellan to use for the longest time and just showed how lazy the coach was to come up with a real solution.

The Maroon trade was different. It was a chance to get an asset for an impending UFA. He liked it here and it’s possible he resigns here.

 

[Spawn]

Seems like nonsense to me.

If there was a rift between them why wouldn't Chiarelli just fire him? I'd say its 50/50 it happens at the end of the season anyway.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Seems like nonsense to me.

If there was a rift between them why wouldn't Chiarelli just fire him? I'd say its 50/50 it happens at the end of the season anyway.

Chia has envisioned Leon as he 2C for some time yet Todd never really gave Nuge a chance with either center on the wing for more than a cup of coffee. I do believe that there is a disconnect between them, I suspect that we will see a coaching change upcoming.

 

[PatrikOverAuston]

On any given day, the narrative seems to shift from "there's a rift" to "TMacT is just doing what Chiapet told him to do" to "Ownership is giving BOTH of them their marching orders".

The truth is probably somewhere in between- TMacT is obsessed with vets, Chia's team-building philosophy is dated, and ownership (re: Katz) meddles just enough to ensure his friends are always somewhere high up in the org.

Either way, it's not a healthy environment and I'm not surprised the on-ice product is suffering.

 

[Chet Manley]

The best way to prevent Letestu from being overused would have been the GM giving the coach the players he needed. Letestu was a fine 4th line centre, the top 9 didn't have the players needed to limit him to that role.

 

[Faelko]

I think this is giving too much credit to Chiarelli. That said he was smart enough not to hurt our cap further by extending these players. I love the return for Letestu, but I think the return on Maroon was poor asset management.

Regarding Maroon...if there was no market for him (and there wasn’t), I’m not sure how that’s bad “asset management”? Bad asset management would’ve been hanging onto him and letting him walk for nothing.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

A coach is paid to coach and a GM to manage. They won’t necessarily always agree on player personnel or on the deployment of player personnel. That doesn’t mean there is a riff (?) (rift I believe is the correct term).

The GM has the hammer and if he doesn’t like what he sees or agree with the player deployment he will fire the coach.

If TMac is fired at years end we will know there was a rift. But I do not believe there is one that serious. Maroon and Letestu were on expiring contracts and it’s incumbent on the GM to either resign them or try to get something for the asset especially seeing how we were not playoff bound.

 

[Faelko]

The best way to prevent Letestu from being overused would have been the GM giving the coach the players he needed. Letestu was a fine 4th line centre, the top 9 didn't have the players needed to limit him to that role.

Many would argue (and rightfully so) that his PP spot should’ve been Puljujarvi’s. The PP hasn’t really been any better since Letestus departure but the PK is much better.

 

[belair]

McCurdy brought something like this up earlier this year. It would be surprising if a lot of HCs and GMs don't see eye to eye on everything. But he mentioned how McLellan's usage of Draisaitl kind of handcuffed Chiarelli this summer, which is quite valid. But how can you fault your coach for using something that works?

 

[oXo Cube]

Seems like nonsense to me.

If there was a rift between them why wouldn't Chiarelli just fire him? I'd say its 50/50 it happens at the end of the season anyway.

Self preservation. The exact moment Chia fires McLellan it's himself that gets to sit in the hot seat.

If he waits for the season to end it probably buys him at least one more year.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I wonder if McLellan told Chia to trade all his scoring wingers away.

 

[Jumptheshark]

You watch too much tv(perhaps). I think it's been a circus show with the lines all season long.

I no longer work gravayard shifts here in the UK so I no longer watch as much as I did before. Due to a couple of on line courses I am doing I found myself awake when games were on for the last two weeks

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Maybe Stairway to Heaven?

 

[Jet Walters]

Connor hasn't been thrilled with McClellan mixing up the lines so much this year. The team was not given a chance this year because of the coaching decisions and stubbornness in adapting their systems, especially in regards to special teams.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I have absolutely no clue if this has any merit. BUT if it does, I hope it means Lucic is traded, put on LTIR, etc. It's obvious he should only be played on the 3rd line, but he makes too much for a third line winger. I mean, I give him one more summer to see if he can lose weight, gain some speed and agility, and I guess learn to handle a puck (probably not possible as he just lacks natural talent). Eh, one can hope.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

I reject any and all comparisons of Peter Chiarelli to Billy Beane, I'm sure Chia would as well, since he's not a stats guy.


I'm not sure if there is any fighting between the two, the only thing I know is Chia for sure views Drai as a center long term, he might not want him played next to McDavid, which McLellan has done quite a bit. I have no information about this, but it wouldn't surprise me if Chia had some input into Lucic and how he wanted to see him used to get him back on track, which could create some friction. Then there is one dubious rumor spread by Tracy Lane that there was a bit of a riff between the two over the Eberle trade, McLellan stating Eberle provided important leadership in the room.

 

[Jumptheshark]

I reject any and all comparisons of Peter Chiarelli to Billy Beane, I'm sure Chia would as well, since he's not a stats guy.


I'm not sure if there is any fighting between the two, the only thing I know is Chia for sure views Drai as a center long term, he might not want him played next to McDavid, which McLellan has done quite a bit. I have no information about this, but it wouldn't surprise me if Chia had some input into Lucic and how he wanted to see him used to get him back on track, which could create some friction. Then there is one dubious rumor spread by Tracy Lane that there was a bit of a riff between the two over the Eberle trade, McLellan stating Eberle provided important leadership in the room.

Used only as a comparison and example of what can happen when the GM and coach/Manager are not on the same page

 

[oobga]

Seems like nonsense to me.

If there was a rift between them why wouldn't Chiarelli just fire him? I'd say its 50/50 it happens at the end of the season anyway.

McLellan gets 3M per year for 2 more years, and I think most believe he was more of an OBC hire than Chia's hire.

I don't think it would be wrong for McLellan to think he actually has a stronger position than Chia. He could relax fishing for the next 2 years and collect his 3M/year if Chia wants to fire him.