Devils Team Discussion (current team/player news and notes) ‎PART XIII

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

A good on ice mentor for a young D would be extremely beneficial... but I hear what you are saying.

But let's be honest...we really don't have one of the best defences in the league...I know what the numbers say, but that is a byproduct of the team much more so than the defensive unit.

they allow (well, at least last year) the least amount of shots against and were (I believe) 6th in goals allowed, along with having the best PK in the league.

isn't that what a defenses job is to do?

 

[JimEIV]

they allow (well, at least last year) the least amount of shots against and were (I believe) 6th in goals allowed, along with having the best PK in the league.

isn't that what a defenses job is to do?

I'm not disregarding any of that but we all know it is much more than just our defensemen accomplishing that...and a better group of defensemen would allow our forwards a little more freedom

 

[Missionhockey]

the team has one of the best team defenses in the league along with a very good goalie. the team lacks offense. I picked arguably the most gifted offensive player to ever play for the Devils (in his prime) in Mogilny.

not a hard concept. or so I thought.

77 point Scott Stevens would be a major boast to the offense.

 

[BrodeursCups]

A good on ice mentor for a young D would be extremely beneficial... but I hear what you are saying.

But let's be honest...we really don't have one of the best defences in the league...I know what the numbers say, but that is a byproduct of the team much more so than the defensive unit.

In terms of overall top-6 on the back end, NJ would be right around high teens/low 20s in the league. However, the potential is there for them to be in the top-10 easily if all the youngsters can take the next step this season. Like you said, it's a team effort. Forwards buying into team first two-way hockey and making the defense's job much easier in deep. This leads to two points: 1)Andy Greene is incredibe for the minutes he logs against top competition . It's actually embarrassing that he didn't even get an invite to team USA's Olympic summer camp last season. Really let that sink in. No invite. 2)Travis Zajac is one of the best defensive centers in the league. Can go head to head with anyone in the league and shut them down. He's our Patrice Bergeron with about 5-10pts less per season. The hate this guy gets from a select few posters on this board is incredibly stupid.

 

[JimEIV]

77 point Scott Stevens would be a major boast to the offense.

Stevens was incredible that season leading the team in scoring, leading the league in +/- with a +53. He finished 7th in Hart voting, 2nd in Norris Trophy voting - losing by the closest ever margin to Bourque - I personally think he was robbed - And I also think Bourque was one of THE most overrated players in the history of the league.

Norris Voting
Raymond Bourque Vote%: 40.95 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 26 21 6
Scott Stevens Vote%: 40.12 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 24 23 6

 

[BrodeursCups]

Stevens was incredible that season leading the team in scoring, leading the league in +/- with a +53. He finished 7th in Hart voting, 2nd in Norris Trophy voting - losing by the closest ever margin to Bourque - I personally think he was robbed - And I also think Bourque was one of THE most overrated players in the history of the league.

Norris Voting
Raymond Bourque Vote%: 40.95 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 26 21 6
Scott Stevens Vote%: 40.12 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 24 23 6

Go on.....

 

[JimEIV]

You know what is really funny...Somebody in the Professional Hockey Writers Association thought is was a good idea to throw Stevens a vote for the Lady Byng - In 2003.

 

[JimEIV]

Go on.....

I think his point totals hide a lot: like the fact that he disappeared in big situations often. He wasn't much of leader and he wasn't a particularly good defender - Remember this all in the context of great players - He was super shooter. A sniper playing on the back end and that made people forget the inadequacies of his game. He was about as good as Mark Howe in my opinion and the points make people delirious.

He (and Patrick Roy) also benefited from playing in the worst division in hockey for about a decade...I mean most years Quebec, Hartford and Buffalo were pretty much a joke for large stretches and the division was for Boston or Montreal to win - It almost insured one of them playing in Eastern Conf. Finals in the old format.

 

[JimEIV]

Watch this video of Boucher's first goal...When he smiles after the goal doesn't he look like Edward Norton?

 

[glenwo2]

Watch this video of Boucher's first goal...When he smiles after the goal doesn't he look like Edward Norton?

You could tell it's the offseason.



Ed Norton? Hmmmmm.....a little.

 

[JimEIV]

If I were in the locker room I would start calling him "worm"

 

[Missionhockey]

It's a stretch.

 

[JRZ DVLS]

the blast from Gelinas they went wide off boards....That was a greene specialty for a while...Shoot for the wall and use as a pass...

 

[manilaNJ]

I mentioned it a while back, but everything I love and nearly everything I fear about Gelinas' game is included in the play that led up to Boucher's goal.

 

[ajdevjet]

rangers signed Hayes

 

[Czech Trio]

rangers signed Hayes

Part of me feels like if you have the loophole to decide where you'll play take it and the other half says I hope he fails because you don't hold out and screw your drafting organization (even though they get a comp. pick).

Another free perk of being a Rangers fan I guess.

What also bugs me is when NYR fans praise this as a "great signing". Please. Get off your high horse, Hayes went to NY because of NY and the heavy college presence. This took no degree of work from the organization.

 

[tycobb]

the team has one of the best team defenses in the league along with a very good goalie. the team lacks offense. I picked arguably the most gifted offensive player to ever play for the Devils (in his prime) in Mogilny.

not a hard concept. or so I thought.

Stevens 93-94 season was just as good as Mogilny 76 goal 92-93 season.

Come playoff time I would have loved to watch Stevens shut the other teams top lines playing 30 mins a game.

 

[tycobb]

Stevens was incredible that season leading the team in scoring, leading the league in +/- with a +53. He finished 7th in Hart voting, 2nd in Norris Trophy voting - losing by the closest ever margin to Bourque - I personally think he was robbed - And I also think Bourque was one of THE most overrated players in the history of the league.

Norris Voting
Raymond Bourque Vote%: 40.95 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 26 21 6
Scott Stevens Vote%: 40.12 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 24 23 6

Stevens is my favorite player ever and he is no where near Bourque career. That season was very close and I sorta wished he won it just because he is the best defenseman to never win one, but Bourque defenitely deserved the win.

That year Bourque put up 20g 71a 91 PTS

He was on the ice for 171 goals and 97 goals allowed (+74)

Stevens had 18g 60a 78 pts.

Stevens was on the ice for 153 goals and 93 goals allowed (+60)

 

[JimEIV]

Stevens is my favorite player ever and he is no where near Bourque career. That season was very close and I sorta wished he won it just because he is the best defenseman to never win one, but Bourque defenitely deserved the win.

That year Bourque put up 20g 71a 91 PTS

He was on the ice for 171 goals and 97 goals allowed (+74)

Stevens had 18g 60a 78 pts.

Stevens was on the ice for 153 goals and 93 goals allowed (+60)

Are you kidding??? Stevens was it in New Jersey that year... His 78 points led his team in scoring..Bourque's 91 WAS SECOND on his team....Stevens surely didn't have the likes of an Oates, Neeley, Junea who all put up over 70 points- and Oates was 100+ point player.

52 of Bourques 91 points were PP points 57%! - as opposed to 26 of Stevens 78 for 33% --- Think Oates and Neeley helped a little there?

Bourque scored 39 points even strength that season... Stevens 52.

You actually illustrated perfectly how people were blinded by Bourque's points.

 

[tycobb]

Are you kidding??? Stevens was it in New Jersey that year... His 78 points led his team in scoring..Bourque's 91 WAS SECOND on his team....Stevens surely didn't have the likes of an Oates, Neeley, Junea who all put up over 70 points- and Oates was 100+ point player.

52 of Bourques 91 points were PP points 57%! - as opposed to 26 of Stevens 78 for 33% --- Think Oates and Neeley helped a little there?

Bourque scored 39 points even strength that season... Stevens 52.

You actually illustrated perfectly how people were blinded by Bourque's points.

Last time I checked the point of the hockey is to score more goals than the opponent.

1993-94 BOS had 289 GF and 252 GA
1993-94 NJD had 306 GF and 220 GA

NJD was the MUCH better team.

MacInnis, Leetch and Zubov all had similar amazing seasons to Stevens that year as well.

Using your logic you can say Zubov was the best player that year. He lead the NYR in PTS and that team had Messier and Graves (and Leetch).

 

[JimEIV]

Last time I checked the point of the hockey is to score more goals than the opponent.

1993-94 BOS had 289 GF and 252 GA
1993-94 NJD had 306 GF and 220 GA

NJD was the MUCH better team.

MacInnis, Leetch and Zubov all had similar amazing seasons to Stevens that year as well.

Using your logic you can say Zubov was the best player that year. He lead the NYR in PTS and that team had Messier and Graves (and Leetch).

No they weren't a "Much" better team, the devils had more distributed scoring and the Bruins were very much a 1 line team...Although the Smolinski line was very good...Please don't tell me about this by a number analysis...I sat in the Boston Garden for over 20 games that season...and Bourque was NOWHERE near as dominate a player that season as Scott Stevens was.

 

[ajdevjet]

Stevens was incredible that season leading the team in scoring, leading the league in +/- with a +53. He finished 7th in Hart voting, 2nd in Norris Trophy voting - losing by the closest ever margin to Bourque - I personally think he was robbed - And I also think Bourque was one of THE most overrated players in the history of the league.

Norris Voting
Raymond Bourque Vote%: 40.95 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 26 21 6
Scott Stevens Vote%: 40.12 - 1st/2nd/3rd place votes = 24 23 6

I agree that Scotty got robbed but your comment about Bourque is insane.... he had 80 or more points 10 TIMES IN HIS 23 YEAR CAREER and he didnt play with Neeley and Oates the whole time so we cant use that excuse. I agree with about 90% of the things you write but to make a comment that Ray Bourque was one of the most overrated players in league history is simply not true

 

[tycobb]

No they weren't a "Much" better team, the devils had more distributed scoring and the Bruins were very much a 1 line team...Although the Smolinski line was very good...Please don't tell me about this by a number analysis...I sat in the Boston Garden for over 20 games that season...and Bourque was NOWHERE near as dominate a player that season as Scott Stevens was.

Your post should be published in the Onion.

Bourque is probably top 3 D of all time at the worst top 5. Stevens is probably ~20 range.

That year the non dominate Bourque had 386 SHOTS (Stevens had 215)

It isn't even debatable that the NJD were the better team. They scored more gave up significantly less and won 4 straight playoff games against them.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I agree that Bourque was overrated, personally/

 

[tycobb]

I agree that Bourque was overrated, personally/

It is a shame people actually think this. Personally Bourque is significantly underrated. He was better than Lidstrom and gets half the recognition.