GDT: Detroit at Carolina, 7 p.m.

Nut Upstrom

You dirty dog!
Dec 18, 2010
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I understood that we might have to trade Mrazek and both guys names should be out there on the trade front. Just like both guys should be given chances to be the starter. It was really more about how are we going to do this without Mrazek barely touching the ice that never made any sense to me. If that was what this was about we could have shipped him to Edmonton months ago. This whole thing has been perplexing. Not even really sure where it goes from here, if we are thinking of qualifying him though, all the more need to ship Nyquist or heck even though unlikely maybe someone bites on Ericsson or something surprising like that to help free some salary.

A while ago I did start banking on Petr's salary wouldn't be around. While not killer, I am not sure what giving him a QO would do to us in terms of the big picture. I hope he can earn it though. Also Blashill was resistant enough I think Petr setting the world on fire down the stretch probably doesn't help Blashill keep his job which has to be interesting for Petr. He can prove his point and maybe oust the people he think wronged him.

Yea, Mrazek's lack of starts was baffling to say the least; I expected it to change when we became legitimate sellers, but the disparity between the number of starts for Howard vs. Mrazek made no sense to me - especially if you want to move one of these guys at the deadline or during the off season.

Going forward, who knows what sort of ill will exists between Petr and the organization or where that might be directed: coaches, management, ownership...?
Interesting point you make concerning Petr and Blashill's future with the team, I wonder if a coaching change impacts his desire to stay here or not. I don't like seeing the team in limbo concerning players who I think have a bright future in the league. Mrazek, AA - hard to swallow the idea that these guys might not be around next year or in the foreseeable future simply due to grudges and ill treatment (be they real or imagined).
 

Claypool

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Jan 12, 2009
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Yea, Mrazek's lack of starts was baffling to say the least; I expected it to change when we became legitimate sellers, but the disparity between the number of starts for Howard vs. Mrazek made no sense to me - especially if you want to move one of these guys at the deadline or during the off season.

Howard was playing better. That's all there is to it. Blashill doesn't care about trade value for either of the goalies. It's not his job to move or showcase any of them for trade. He's not making lineup decisions based on potential deals.

As for AA wanting out after this season over a terrible contract dispute brought on by his agent, the Red Wings will still own his rights and Holland made it pretty clear he's not trading him. I don't think the team will bring Mrazek back next year anyway because they'll have to qualify him at his current contract price and he's not worth that.
 

avssuc

Hockey is for everyone!
May 1, 2016
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Monster game from Helm, and Daley again proving he was a good offseason signing.

I don't typically agree with you, but when I do, it's on Daley. Dude does so many things right out there, and he has for every game I've managed to catch.
 

turkleton85

Registered User
Dec 12, 2017
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awesome game, makes you remember how much fun winning hockey can be.

Mrazek with another great performance, stopping 36 shots
Nyquist with aggressive forecheck and physicality
Mantha 6 shots, 7 hits. play like this every game big guy
 

theYman

Registered User
Feb 28, 2008
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Missed this one. Helm with a 3 point night? I'll take it. And that Daley blast was nice. He can shoot the puck still.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Aug 11, 2009
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Their is no need to do a "I told ya so" regarding mrazek.

Everyone with an eye on the future knew and knows still, that only one of the two has the better chance of being our goalie long term, for no other reason than age.

Howard was great in the fall but then quickly slowed and then like clockwork got hurt.

Howard deserved to start more then Petr at the beginning but carry the load? No and that' where the mistake occurrd

Nothing has changed however

Deal Howard

Qualify Mrazek

and sign a cheap vet backup
 

RedWingzz

Everybody loves Raymond
Apr 14, 2009
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I love how Petr's fall is always attributed to some conspiracy about the organization trying to ruin him or mistreating the poor helpless boy... "Jimmy D made Helene smear him so George McPhee won't try and steal the worst NHL goalie from 16/17! How dare they be critical of a $4M goalie that plays like he makes $650k! It's not his fault, he's young, it's Blashill and the defenses fault!"

I'm glad that he's finally playing well again after almost 2 whole calendar years, but I won't blame the FO if they decide that the risk of him blowing it again still isn't worth the $4.15M QO.

And yea, I know.... That means I'm automatically choosing Howard as the goalie of the future or something like that.... :rolleyes:

More wins than losses, 2.74 gaa, .914 s%. Look around the league at what starting goalies make. All of a sudden his numbers are actually decent.

I also find it funny how (not accusing you, but just saying) some people are saying "if you don't count his last 3 weeks his numbers are garbage!" I could easily fire right back and say "if you don't count his first 3 weeks, his numbers are quite good." I hate the argument that people always use where they "ignore" a players hot streak, and say their numbers are junk. At the end of the day, a 2.74 gaa .914 s% are decent, especially considering the defense that play for Detroit.

I don't think anyone is saying lock Mrazek up for 7 years. He is absolutely streaky, and it is risky signing him due to his inconsistencies. That's why you offer him a 1-year deal, and see what happens next year, rather than play safe and get rid of him for a draft pick that will probably never even play in the NHL.
 
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RedWingzz

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Also nothing has changed on that area, that bad-playing Howard is untradeable.

So if you want to qualify Mrazek and keep him, your "cheap vet" will be Jimmy Howard at least for 1 year.

Then deal with it for a year. Having Howard as a 5 million backup for one more season isn't the end of the world. It is not ideal, but it also doesn't mean that we get rid of Petr because we already have a goalie making starter money. Deal with it for a year, then Howard moves on 2019 offseason.
 
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RedWingzz

Everybody loves Raymond
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**** Mantha. Get him off my team.

I don't mind playing a chippy game but cheapshotting some random guy in a "scrum" isn't proving anything to anyone other than you're just an *******.

Mantha was fine last night. Just stop hoping for a dominant first line power forward, 35 goal guy. Unfortunately it doesn't appear he is that. He is still a valuable scorer. In the long run his quiet 2nd half will only help us in the salary cap world. Had he kept up his 40 goal pace all year, he'd be signing for a whole lot more than he will make this offseason.

Also, get him the **** out of the net-front PP role, and put him on the wing. He has the best shot on the team, yet he's being asked to be Tomas Holmstrom.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Also nothing has changed on that area, that bad-playing Howard is untradeable.

So if you want to qualify Mrazek and keep him, your "cheap vet" will be Jimmy Howard at least for 1 year.

If that's the case, that Howard has no value whatsoever, then why is he on our roster/not traded already?
 

datsyukfan

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Jul 5, 2007
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Trade howard to isles and retain some on the deal. Even if it’s half, we get some value back and some cap relief. Petr needs to be given a long chance (this year and next) to show that he is a franchise goalie. If he does lock him up, if not we move on and see our options from there free agency, prospects, trade, etc
 

Claypool

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Jan 12, 2009
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Oh God here comes Mrazek's i told you so posse.

Mrazek was awful for a very long time. Lately he is very good. It's possible for these things to both be true. It's also okay to be tentatively optimistic for him based on his recent performance. It's also possible for him to show his inconsistency again and regress in the next few days or weeks.

Instead of being *****es to each other why not just enjoy the hot hand while it lasts and see how far it gets us?
Only reason anyone wanted Mrazek playing was to help with the tank. Howard was playing too well. It'll be hilarious when Mrazek is the sole reason this team finishes outside of the bottom 10. I better not see anyone complaining about that.
 

Lazlo Hollyfeld

The jersey ad still sucks
Mar 4, 2004
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Only reason anyone wanted Mrazek playing was to help with the tank. Howard was playing too well. It'll be hilarious when Mrazek is the sole reason this team finishes outside of the bottom 10. I better not see anyone complaining about that.
I wanted Mrazek playing in hopes he would get his game back together and either become a movable asset or prove himself worth signing this off season.
 

Dotter

THE ATHLETIC IS GARBAGE
Jul 2, 2014
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I wanted Mrazek playing in hopes he would get his game back together and either become a movable asset or prove himself worth signing this off season.

He'll be a movable asset, but the return won't be a top 5 pick Wings might miss out on in the process. And I highly doubt Wings qualify him for his 4 million. His current hot streak doesn't justify that money now that we already know the whole book about his inconsistent play and his reported character.

He could mature out of that and learn more consistency, sure. But it's not worth a 4 million dollar gamble when Detroit is already paying Howard who is already a proven team player and is also a hot & inconstant goalie. One has to go and Mrazek should give a better return; hence, better asset management. Just sucks that Mrazek's hot streak might cost us a top 5 draft pick. But the return he brings is certainly welcomed.
 
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Zetterberg4Captain

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For the same reason Mrazek is still on the roster. Nobody wants him.


possibly

however the rumours that we talked with Edmonton about mrazek in Nov didn't seem to imply that Edmonton said "we will take him for free." It sounded more like Holland wanted more then absolute zero return

is howard in your mind worth absolutely nothing?
is mrazek is your mind worth absolutely nothing

fair enough if the answer is yes

but to me "something" is good enough when it comes to Howard

ie, howard to the NYI for a conditional 2019 7th, condition being they win the stanley cup
 

Redder Winger

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May 4, 2017
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possibly

however the rumours that we talked with Edmonton about mrazek in Nov didn't seem to imply that Edmonton said "we will take him for free." It sounded more like Holland wanted more then absolute zero return

is howard in your mind worth absolutely nothing?
is mrazek is your mind worth absolutely nothing

fair enough if the answer is yes

but to me "something" is good enough when it comes to Howard

ie, howard to the NYI for a conditional 2019 7th, condition being they win the stanley cup

Howard's trade value has diminished.
If you traded him in mid November, you could have gotten something by retaining salary.
Good luck now.
 

Claypool

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Jan 12, 2009
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Howard's trade value has diminished.
If you traded him in mid November, you could have gotten something by retaining salary.
Good luck now.
His contract was always going to be difficult to move regardless of his play. There's very few teams in the league that need goaltending.
 

Redder Winger

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His contract was always going to be difficult to move regardless of his play. There's very few teams in the league that need goaltending.

There are several teams that need goaltending.
And if you were selling him in Mid November, when his save % was 934, you could have moved him a lot easier than today, with his sv pct at 911
 

Redder Winger

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Howard was playing better. That's all there is to it. Blashill doesn't care about trade value for either of the goalies. It's not his job to move or showcase any of them for trade. He's not making lineup decisions based on potential deals.

As for AA wanting out after this season over a terrible contract dispute brought on by his agent, the Red Wings will still own his rights and Holland made it pretty clear he's not trading him. I don't think the team will bring Mrazek back next year anyway because they'll have to qualify him at his current contract price and he's not worth that.

If Mrazek finishes the season over .500 and pushes his sv pct up towards .920 and goals against to 2.50 or so....
Do you think the Wings let him walk because he's not worth $4M?

That would be a potentially really dumb decision.

Given what I've seen from Mrazek, good and bad, my ass would have puckered at the thought of losing him for nothing and then watching him rise for some other team.
And that was before his recent hot streak.

I don't see why a team like Detroit needs to rush on decisions for young players -- other than being trapped by Ken Holland's idiotic salary structure.
 

Claypool

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Jan 12, 2009
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There are several teams that need goaltending.
And if you were selling him in Mid November, when his save % was 934, you could have moved him a lot easier than today, with his sv pct at 911

In November while this team was third in the Atlantic? Why would Holland do that?

If teams wanted goaltending then they could have had Mrazek basically for free. No one wanted him.

If Mrazek finishes the season over .500 and pushes his sv pct up towards .920 and goals against to 2.50 or so....
Do you think the Wings let him walk because he's not worth $4M?

That would be a potentially really dumb decision.

Well they aren't spending over $9 million in goaltending again next season. If they can't move Howard then they walk away from Mrazek. I don't see any other scenario to make it work unless Zetterberg and Kronwall "retire" and those contracts are moved to Phoenix.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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In November while this team was third in the Atlantic? Why would Holland do that?

If teams wanted goaltending then they could have had Mrazek basically for free. No one wanted him.



Well they aren't spending over $9 million in goaltending again next season. If they can't move Howard then they walk away from Mrazek. I don't see any other scenario to make it work unless Zetterberg and Kronwall "retire" and those contracts are moved to Phoenix.


would the team walk away from AA because of Nielsens contract?

what rebuilding team in their right mind thinks this way?

trade him, retain salary, only ask for unachievable conditional 7th round pick or buy him out

so long as you save $1 of cap space its worth it
 

Claypool

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Jan 12, 2009
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would the team walk away from AA because of Nielsens contract?

what rebuilding team in their right mind thinks this way?

trade him, retain salary, only ask for unachievable conditional 7th round pick or buy him out

so long as you save $1 of cap space its worth it

Right, I'm all for moving Howard even if you have to retain $1-2 million. The point is someone still has to trade for him. I suppose they could buy out the final year of his deal. If my math is correct they'd save $3,300,000 next season and have a cap penalty of $850,000 for the next two seasons.
 
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Zetterberg4Captain

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Right, I'm all for moving Howard even if you have to retain $1-2 million. The point is someone still has to trade for him. I suppose they could buy out the final year of his deal. If my math is correct they'd save $3,300,000 next season and have a cap penalty of $850,000 for the next two seasons.


look man I get it, Mrazek was awful for the better part of a year

but the team owes it to itself to go with youth as we rebuild

the absolute worst thing that will happen is this, mrazek sucks

so what.

we dont have a young 19, 20 or 21 year old upstart goalie beating at the door in our system and howard will never be here when the team is decent/good again but mrazek will or could be
 

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