Player Discussion Darnell Nurse vs Matthew Benning

[Daryls Friend]

Easy to say now that Benning is playing really poorly. Nurse was looking nearly as poor on many nights in the past couple of seasons. Last year a lot of his bad play was masked by his limited role and how good the rest of the team was. That hasn't been the case this year. The whole team has been struggling and basically every defenseman outside of Nurse has struggled this year. Benning is probably playing without confidence right now and IMO should've been sent down to AHL a couple of weeks ago as he's a liability out there. Anyway, this Benning vs Nurse discussion was legit last year. It's just that Nurse took a giant step forward while Benning has regressed and is having a big sophomore slump. It happens.

Thats absolute bs/not close to accurate.
Nurse has never been in the same universe as bad as Benning has been this year. Benning on his very best days has and will always be a marginal NHL'r

 

[BudBundy]

Nurse is a horse. He is big, ridiculously fast and is getting stronger all the time. He has calmed his game down to the point where he mostly lets opponents come to him then he knocks the puck away, keeps them outside or flat-out rubs them out. If they dump it, he is quick to retrieve it. He is big enough to cut a guy off and break up a cycle, fast enough to both join the rush or stand a guy up at the blue line and still recover. His puck skills and confidence are coming nicely. He is a mean SOB on top of it all. Im ecstatic that Chiarelli resisted the temptation to trade him.

Benning, on the other hand, is a guy that has to get by on his brains as his size is below average for an NHL D and his speed is just ok. He has excellent balance and can quickly stand up and catch a guy with an open ice hit when they dont expect it, but he isnt big enough or strong enough to win the board battle or break up a cycle. He wilts under a heavy forecheck, much the same as Russell, so everybody dumps it into his corner now. His passing skills, when he has time, are excellent. His shot is ok. If he wasnt a RH shot, he probably would be in the AHL.

In summary, a team can win a cup with a guy like Nurse in the top 4 whereas a team that has Benning slotted higher than sheltered #6 RH side, isnt good enough.

 

[MoneyGuy]

Nurse is a horse. He is big, ridiculously fast and is getting stronger all the time. He has calmed his game down to the point where he mostly lets opponents come to him then he knocks the puck away, keeps them outside or flat-out rubs them out. If they dump it, he is quick to retrieve it. He is big enough to cut a guy off and break up a cycle, fast enough to both join the rush or stand a guy up at the blue line and still recover. His puck skills and confidence are coming nicely. He is a mean SOB on top of it all. Im ecstatic that Chiarelli resisted the temptation to trade him.

Benning, on the other hand, is a guy that has to get by on his brains as his size is below average for an NHL D and his speed is just ok. He has excellent balance and can quickly stand up and catch a guy with an open ice hit when they dont expect it, but he isnt big enough or strong enough to win the board battle or break up a cycle. He wilts under a heavy forecheck, much the same as Russell, so everybody dumps it into his corner now. His passing skills, when he has time, are excellent. His shot is ok. If he wasnt a RH shot, he probably would be in the AHL.

In summary, a team can win a cup with a guy like Nurse in the top 4 whereas a team that has Benning slotted higher than sheltered #6 RH side, isnt good enough.

Don't kill the messenger but the other day Struds said that Benning has been playing well.

 

[BudBundy]

Don't kill the messenger but the other day Struds said that Benning has been playing well.

Well, Struds opinion is certainly worth more than mine. To me, Benning has become a fringe NHLer, but if a guy like Struddy sees something more in him, maybe I’m wrong.

In fairness i was just comparing him to Nurse as per the OP.

 

[Zaddy]

Some real recency bias going on here. Benning quite clearly outplayed Nurse last year.

Nurse is the better player today (and very likely going forward as well) and Benning is going through a rough patch. Those are all facts.

 

[GMofOilers]

That hockey IQ though......

 

[yababy]

Nurse doesn't have a hockey head.

In the offensive zone with 3 seconds left against Chicago and he turns his back on a rebound to get back on defense. 3 seconds left!

Multi million dollar physical gifts with a 10 cent head.

 

[ujju2]

Benning greatly outplayed Nurse last year. Nurse is greatly outplaying Benning this year. Based on his physical tools and draft pedigree, I say Nurse will be a good top 4 guy at the very least (he probably already is), whereas Benning has a chance to be a third pairing guy, but not if he plays like he has this season.

 

[Soliloquy of a Dogge]

Easy to say now that Benning is playing really poorly. Nurse was looking nearly as poor on many nights in the past couple of seasons. Last year a lot of his bad play was masked by his limited role and how good the rest of the team was. That hasn't been the case this year. The whole team has been struggling and basically every defenseman outside of Nurse has struggled this year. Benning is probably playing without confidence right now and IMO should've been sent down to AHL a couple of weeks ago as he's a liability out there. Anyway, this Benning vs Nurse discussion was legit last year. It's just that Nurse took a giant step forward while Benning has regressed and is having a big sophomore slump. It happens.

As has been pointed out, pre-injury Nurse vs post-injury Nurse were two different players. Nurse before his injury was playing at a much higher level than anything Benning ever has displayed. And again, as others pointed out, there is bias when it comes to evaluating highly touted and highly drafted players versus players who are expected to amount to very little and become pleasant surprises.

Benning's play in the NHL, even last season, never screamed anything more than a #5 or #6 bottom pairing guy. The faults in his game that are costing this team tons of goals and games this season were overlooked and ignored last season even though he wasn't anywhere as much of a disaster. The lack of intelligence in his own zone was exposed in the playoffs and his inability to win battles and move the puck out of danger then are certainly being glossed over. He may have been slightly better overall than Nurse was in the post-season (I don't subscribe to that theory and don't think he was particularly good) but his worst games were demonstrably worse than Nurse's worst games.

The fact is, the guy is not an NHL defenseman and his ceiling, if everything pans out, is nothing more than a #6 or #7 guy. As @walktheboulavard mentioned, speedy and tenacious teams on the forecheck that can cycle the puck and recover loose pucks like the Jets (which the good teams in this league excel at) make it a point to pick on him and absolutely embarrass him every single night.

 

[Soliloquy of a Dogge]

Nurse doesn't have a hockey head.

In the offensive zone with 3 seconds left against Chicago and he turns his back on a rebound to get back on defense. 3 seconds left!

Multi million dollar physical gifts with a 10 cent head.

Can you keep the ridiculous nonsense you spew contained to the main boards?

Anybody still spouting the nonsensical fallacy that Nurse's IQ is a detriment to his game instead of an attribute clearly doesn't have a clue what they're talking about.

 

[Zaddy]

As has been pointed out, pre-injury Nurse vs post-injury Nurse were two different players. Nurse before his injury was playing at a much higher level than anything Benning ever has displayed. And again, as others pointed out, there is bias when it comes to evaluating highly touted and highly drafted players versus players who are expected to amount to very little and become pleasant surprises.

Benning's play in the NHL, even last season, never screamed anything more than a #5 or #6 bottom pairing guy. The faults in his game that are costing this team tons of goals and games this season were overlooked and ignored last season even though he wasn't anywhere as much of a disaster. The lack of intelligence in his own zone was exposed in the playoffs and his inability to win battles and move the puck out of danger then are certainly being glossed over. He may have been slightly better overall than Nurse was in the post-season (I don't subscribe to that theory and don't think he was particularly good) but his worst games were demonstrably worse than Nurse's worst games.

The fact is, the guy is not an NHL defenseman and his ceiling, if everything pans out, is nothing more than a #6 or #7 guy. As @walktheboulavard mentioned, speedy and tenacious teams on the forecheck that can cycle the puck and recover loose pucks like the Jets (which the good teams in this league excel at) make it a point to pick on him and absolutely embarrass him every single night.

I'm not disputing the fact that Nurse has vastly higher upside, heck I even say that in my post from last season which is on the first page of this thread. I just think people are dogging on Benning hard now because he's been (really) bad this year but are quick to forget that he was actually a pretty solid D for most of last year. I think he's probably a #5D at best and that's the level he was playing at last year, which is more than what Nurse was doing.

I also think a lot has to do with partners. Last year Nurse played a lot with Gryba IIRC, and that's not a very nice pairing. This year he has had better partners (Larsson and Russell) and had an easier time because of it. Benning on the other hand, while struggling mightily on his own, has had some very inconsistent players on his side since we really don't have any left-side d-man this year that has been solid except for Nurse.

Anyway, as I already mentioned previously, I think the best for Benning is to get sent down to the AHL, and really I believe he should've been sent down a few weeks ago already. He's drowning in the NHL right now, he needs to get a reset and find his way back to his game again. He's hurting the team right now.

 

[Da McBomb]

Nurse has come so far this season. He's way better now and in the future than Benning ever will be. It shouldn't even be a debate anymore. The real debate now should be Benning vs Davidson for #6 - and I'd choose Davidson over Benning right now. I'm not a Benning hater at all. I thought he looked very good last year for a rookie. No doubt that he is struggling this season.. but that's common for young dmen. I still see a player there.

 

[yababy]

Can you keep the ridiculous nonsense you spew contained to the main boards?

Anybody still spouting the nonsensical fallacy that Nurse's IQ is a detriment to his game instead of an attribute clearly doesn't have a clue what they're talking about.

My opinion doesn't match yours so its wrong? Big LOL

I just finished giving an example of why I think he's a blockhead. Go ahead and try to justify Nurse turning his back on that rebound with 3 seconds left

 

[Soliloquy of a Dogge]

My opinion doesn't match yours so its wrong? Big LOL

No, your opinion doesn't match reality.

There's a difference.

 

[shoop]

For the entirety of last season Benning had a better year than Nurse. Nurse was certainly trending up towards the end of last season.

The jump in Nurse's game this year has been mind blowing. Benning has regressed.

If someone had said that Nurse and Benning would have been decent 5/6 defencemen at the start of the season everyone would have taken that.

Nurse has certainly played at a 2/3 level. Maybe not a top pairing guy on a good team, but certainly good enough to be on the second pairing for almost any team in the league.

Benning has been horribad. I think keeping Benning on the Oilers too long this season is a serious concern with the decision-making of the Oilers braintrust.

 

[t0nedeff]

Benning was an illusion and I never hopped on that train cause he has never looked very good to me. Last year I was complaining how he constantly got into the line up over Davidson and Bennings "play" somehow convinced a large contingent of this board that Davidson was expendable because Benning was as good as Davidson ever was the previous year which was garbage in my eyes and its pretty evident with his play this year. The team was good last year so all of this players miss givings were hidden or people just didn't want to acknowledge it.

 

[yababy]

No, your opinion doesn't match reality.

There's a difference.

Your reality.
There are 2 distinct opinion camps about Nurse, I'm on the opposite side, not the wrong side

 

[Soliloquy of a Dogge]

Your reality.
There are 2 distinct opinion camps about Nurse, I'm on the opposite side, not the wrong side

A question. Have you actually, you know, watched Nurse play hockey this season?

You've pointed out one play and seem to be using that as a basis to promote this intelligence narrative. Even some of the loudest voices who believed his intelligence on the ice was a shortcoming have realized that that was an erroneous rush to judgement based on his excellent play this entire season thus far.

Sounds like you're watching a version of Nurse none of the rest of us are watching with that erroneous talking point because while there are still differing opinions as to what his top end potential is, the camp you speak of that still questions his intelligence as a hockey player, well, it doesn't exist.

 

[walktheboulavard]

My opinion doesn't match yours so its wrong? Big LOL

I just finished giving an example of why I think he's a blockhead. Go ahead and try to justify Nurse turning his back on that rebound with 3 seconds left

If that's what your using as evidence or as a measuring stick to derive to the conclusion that Nurse has a 10 cent brain then by your metric he must be better than Strome in the ozone. Strome telegraphed and committed to pass before assessing the play and realizing he had a open net in that same game. Ok so I got it nobody ever mess up in the ozone or they are blockhead.

 

[Daryls Friend]

Your reality.
There are 2 distinct opinion camps about Nurse, I'm on the opposite side, not the wrong side

If you are in ANY camp, you have a bias & don't see reality.
Hence your point of view on Nurse is without merit

 

[Garbo Man]

Igor Ulinov>Matt Benning

 

[yababy]

A question. Have you actually, you know, watched Nurse play hockey this season?

It's because I'm watching Nurse that I'm seeing this. Maybe I shouldn't pay so much attention.

 

[booyakasha]

It's because I'm watching Nurse that I'm seeing this. Maybe I shouldn't pay so much attention.

Eyes are useless when the mind is blind.

 

[Soliloquy of a Dogge]

Eyes are useless when the mind is blind.

Succinctly put and nicely expressed.

 

[Metamind]

I think the real question today is Benning vs Davidson