Proposal: Columbus - Edmonton

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
5,002
2,659
Michigan
Read the OP...
There is no mention of Dubois or Jones in it..
Oilers fans are upset because Draisaitl was mentioned here.. for lesser players..
As for Drai proposals from Oilers fan.. show me one that doesnt have a franchise player coming back our way..

My whole point in bringing up Dubois is that the CBJ have NO NEED FOR DRAISAITL. You guys seem to be disrespected in some way because of this idea. There's been MULTIPLE comments made to belittle Atkinson and Dubois as of now. The reasons are to simply reduce the perception of the value of both players, to make the OP trade proposal seem worse and to make yourselves feel better for having the "steal" Puljujarvi over the "bust" Dubois.

And then you guys get disrespected when people say Jones has more value than Draisaitl, whether its to the CBJ or to the league in general.

Good luck acquiring that franchise player. Because you're NOT getting Jones.
 

ChaoticOrange

Registered User
Jun 29, 2008
50,532
29,155
Edmonton
Just forget it.. he's obviously not reading your posts or willing to answer your questions. Hell he's not even capable of having a constructive conversation. You've used his own points against him and he just flops and finds another excuse as to why Oiler players are trash.

If there was any other excuse than Oilers=Bad, this would be even more entertaining.

I honestly can’t look away at this point. It’s like a sodium truck hit a manure hauler on the side of the road and I’m rubbernecking. It’s absolutely fascinating.
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
5,002
2,659
Michigan
Players like Draisaitl are not moved for guys like Atkinson and Wennberg. They’re supporting cast players. You wouldn’t move Jones for Klefbom and Puljujarvi.

:squint: :puppy: :whaaa?:

I'm prolly wasting my time here.

I'll go hit the J and think things over.
 

ChaoticOrange

Registered User
Jun 29, 2008
50,532
29,155
Edmonton
My whole point in bringing up Dubois is that the CBJ have NO NEED FOR DRAISAITL. You guys seem to be disrespected in some way because of this idea. There's been MULTIPLE comments made to belittle Atkinson and Dubois as of now. The reasons are to simply reduce the perception of the value of both players, to make the OP trade proposal seem worse and to make yourselves feel better for having the "steal" Puljujarvi over the "bust" Dubois.

And then you guys get disrespected when people say Jones has more value than Draisaitl, whether its to the CBJ or to the league in general.

Good luck acquiring that franchise player. Because you're NOT getting Jones.

Most Oiler fans want Jones because we KNOW he’s excellent. He’s exactly what we need. He’s exactly what you hoped he’d turn into when you moved RyJo for him.

As I said above, Atkinson is a nice player. I want him at the right price. If it costs Draisaitl, that’s not the right price.

It’s great that you think so highly of Dubois. I was excited we might get him at 4, he’s a good player. It’s great that you don’t think you need Draisaitl. Guess what? We do. Really, really badly. We can’t move him for lesser pieces. We lost the Hall trade badly . We lost the Eberle trade badly. We dumped good picks off a cliff for Griffin Reinhart. We gave up a 2nd and a 3rd to hire a bad GM and a mediocre coach. We can’t lose another trade. We can’t give up the best piece in a deal and dump JP for no reason - doing so again would ruin us and probably lead to 97 demanding a trade down the road.

We need to do what OP is trying to do; give up two quarters and three dimes for a dollar. We need to move our first some other assets for help right now.

Funny, you still don’t say OP is a good deal for Edmonton. If I’m not mistaken you haven’t said that all thread long.
 
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ChaoticOrange

Registered User
Jun 29, 2008
50,532
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Edmonton
:squint: :puppy: :whaaa?:

I'm prolly wasting my time here.

I'll go hit the J and think things over.

Probably, considering you seem to be bound and determined to underrate Draisaitl at all costs.

It’s Draisaitl + for a prime aged #1 defenceman with term. If that’s not offered, then he’s not moving. There’s a lot wrong with this team but McDavid/Draisaitl/RNH/Nurse/Larsson aren’t it.

You want to know the difference between Columbus and Edmonton right now?

Seth Jones, and supporting cast players like Anderson and Jenner. You wouldn’t move Jones or Panarin for lesser pieces, so surely you can understand why we don’t want to move Leon for lesser pieces either.

Get good players, build around good players. Move lesser assets for help. You guys did that for years and somehow get annoyed when we want to do the same?
 

LTIR

Registered User
Nov 8, 2013
25,863
12,828
My whole point in bringing up Dubois is that the CBJ have NO NEED FOR DRAISAITL. You guys seem to be disrespected in some way because of this idea. There's been MULTIPLE comments made to belittle Atkinson and Dubois as of now. The reasons are to simply reduce the perception of the value of both players, to make the OP trade proposal seem worse and to make yourselves feel better for having the "steal" Puljujarvi over the "bust" Dubois.

And then you guys get disrespected when people say Jones has more value than Draisaitl, whether its to the CBJ or to the league in general.

Good luck acquiring that franchise player. Because you're NOT getting Jones.
So how you would feel if a proposal is made for PLD with lesser players going you way. Would you not go if you want PLD you better give up a player that will hurt you.. ie overpayment..

Not sure how hard is that to get.

OP does nothing for Edmonton.. and good for you if you already have a #1C..

You didnt stop at that.. you continued on to bash Drai, Puljujarvi and the Oilers.
 

Ck1

Registered User
Feb 10, 2018
1,109
678
Edmonton
It's funny that you think its argument shifting when the reality is it's just proving you wrong. Just like when I said when someone makes a point proving you wrong you throw shade at other teams, like bringing up the down year blue jackets.

It's a down year when a team makes the playoffs 3 out of 4 years. Not missed the playoffs 3 out of 4 years. Theres a massive undispitable difference.

Rebuilding is a couple year project, not 10+ years after 4 1st overall picks and still cant make the playoffs, that's just not having talent.
And FYI talent alone doesn't win you hockey games. There are many other contributing factors like the system that's put in by the coaches the chemistry the players have, the effort the players put out on the ice and some luck thrown in just to name a few
 

ChaoticOrange

Registered User
Jun 29, 2008
50,532
29,155
Edmonton
Probably next year or 2......



Fans thinking he's worth Seth Jones "+".....

No one said that. If they did they’re silly.

What most people are saying is we’d only
move Draisaitl for Jones. Which means offers of lesser pieces need not apply.

You moved a similar young player to Draisaitl for Jones, so you should empathize that as fans of these teams offers of lesser assets in quantity leave a bad taste in your mouth.

It’s also not helping your cause that both Atkinson and Wennberg had bad years by their standards and Draisaitl showed his 77 point season was no fluke.

We can’t operate on what-if. We can’t hope that Atkinson regains 35 goal form and Wennberg regains his 16-17 form. When the ask is Draisaitl, we have to deal in what the player is today, and that is a winger that put up almost identical numbers as RNH this year, and a centre with similar results to Ryan Strome. That might be unfair to Columbus’ players, but you’re asking for one of the best U-23 players in the entire NHL. If Edmonton isn’t 100% sure that they’re getting exactly what they need to contend for years to come, then moving their 2nd most valuable asset and arguably their 4th-5th most valuable asset is a complete fool’s errand.
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
5,002
2,659
Michigan
Funny, you still don’t say OP is a good deal for Edmonton. If I’m not mistaken you haven’t said that all thread long.

Ya I haven't, because its not good for either team.

My points are this: Puljujarvi sucks, Dubois is not THAT much worse than Drasaitl now and could be better in the future, and Draisaitl is NOT more valuable than Jones. Also, because of Dubois, Jones has more value to the CBJ than Draisaitl.

To be clear, Draisaitl does not suck. Puljujarvi does.
 
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Tobias Kahun

Registered User
Oct 3, 2017
41,662
50,519
*looks through whole thread, doesnt see a since once of an intelligent point from said poster*

Meanwhile I've been a valid point every single time I made a post

Crazy how much facts really weight over opinion, especially when you dont have to move the goal post as often as you do to make a post and throw shade at other teams and players to draw attention to how bad Edmonton players are.
Nothing you have posted has been facts, it has all been your opinion, im guessing your last account got banned.
 

ChaoticOrange

Registered User
Jun 29, 2008
50,532
29,155
Edmonton
Ya I haven't, because its not good for either team.

My points are this: Puljujarvi sucks, Dubois is not THAT much worse than Drasaitl now and could be better in the future, and Draisaitl is NOT more valuable than Jones. Also, because of Dubois, Jones has more value to the CBJ than Draisaitl.

To be clear, Draisaitl does not suck. Puljujarvi does.

Puljujarvi does not suck. He’s young, in a weird country where he doesn’t speak the language and his most common line mate was the corpse of Milan Lucic. If this is as good as JP gets - remembering that he’s only 19 and gets zero powerplay time - he’s still a massive 3rd line winger with a shot. He scored 10 even strength goals with 13 minutes a night of ice time. He’s got work to do in a lot of areas, but he also needs a coach to play to his strengths which our staff refuses to do.

His floor is Benoit Pouliot. His ceiling is through the roof.

Wennberg is a cautionary tale to not give up on young players too early. He had a very comparable 19 year old season to Wennberg and probably should have been playing 20+ minutes in the AHL instead of 12 in the AHL for his own benefit, but our wonderful GM is allergic to depth and bought out one effective winger and traded another one at pennies on the dollar so we had no choice. I don’t like everything Todd McLellan does but I do feel bad for him. He was handed chicken shit this season and told to make chicken salad.

Now that we’re talking reasonably - I don’t blame you for not wanting to give up Jones. 1D are impossible to trade for. Most Oilers fans point is that Draisaitl isn’t available for less. He’s 1C on a lot of McDavidless teams and he’s still just scratching the surface of what he’s capable of.
 
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North Cole

♧ Lem
Jan 22, 2017
11,351
12,585
Wenberg, Atkinson for Draisaitl, Puljujärvi

Wenberg didn't impress during the regular, but started to play much better closer to the playoffs and clearly is a top6 player, who can play 2C or 3C role on the Oilers. Atkinson already has 40 goal season and looks very impressive with Panarin. He can be even better with McDavid and he's really fast.

Columbus gets another player, they can build a scoring line around. And a prospect, who can still be very good.

Atkinson was non existent for half the season.

If cbus wants drai then werenski is the centre piece. Jones is never available, and we need someone like werenski.

I would do:

Drai, pool, 2nd
For
Werenski, Atkinson, 1st (lottery protect)

Or

Drai, klef, 1st 2019 (lottery protect), 2020 third or a b prospect
For

Jones, atkinson

^ Jones is that good
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
5,002
2,659
Michigan
Probably, considering you seem to be bound and determined to underrate Draisaitl at all costs.

It’s Draisaitl + for a prime aged #1 defenceman with term. If that’s not offered, then he’s not moving. There’s a lot wrong with this team but McDavid/Draisaitl/RNH/Nurse/Larsson aren’t it.

Get good players, build around good players. Move lesser assets for help. You guys did that for years and somehow get annoyed when we want to do the same?

The problem is your idea that I am "underrating" Draisaitl is the same as your idea that I am "overrating" Atiknson, Dubois and (somewhat) Jones. And yet you guys continue to claim its OTHERS underrating the EDM players.

And no it hasn't been Draisaitl "+" in here. Its been Jones "+", or straight up, which again, doesn't help EITHER team. BUT you are disrespected by this thought process as you believe Draisaitl is worth more than Jones and that the CBJ would be dumb to turn that down.

Also to reiterate, Puljujarvi is terrible. Him as a "+" does literally NOTHING for the CBJ.
 

ChaoticOrange

Registered User
Jun 29, 2008
50,532
29,155
Edmonton
The problem is your idea that I am "underrating" Draisaitl is the same as your idea that I am "overrating" Atiknson, Dubois and (somewhat) Jones. And yet you guys continue to claim its OTHERS underrating the EDM players.

And no it hasn't been Draisaitl "+" in here. Its been Jones "+", or straight up, which again, doesn't help EITHER team. BUT you are disrespected by this thought process as you believe Draisaitl is worth more than Jones and that the CBJ would be dumb to turn that down.

Also to reiterate, Puljujarvi is terrible. Him as a "+" does literally NOTHING for the CBJ.

I don’t think Oiler fans are underrating anyone. We KNOW Jones is amazing. That’s why we want him. I think people saying Draisaitl + are frustrated by the seemingly endless parade of fans around the league wanting to acquire Drai at a discount, as if he hasn’t been incredible so far.

Yes there are Oiler fans open to the idea of trading him - not many, it’s pretty much just one dude that makes all the proposals with Drai in them - and as I said, the trade targets those people want are very specific. No one is offering him around for ‘affordable’ prices.

Similarly to Draisaitl, if you don’t value or need Puljujarvi, that’s fine. We do need him and do not view him as some top up or throw in.
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
5,002
2,659
Michigan
If Edmonton isn’t 100% sure that they’re getting exactly what they need to contend for years to come, then moving their 2nd most valuable asset and arguably their 4th-5th most valuable asset is a complete fool’s errand.


And how many people in here have said that EDM should take the original trade?

Now compare that to the amount of people downplaying the CBJ players, claiming how bad it would be for EDM.

Now compare THAT to you guy self-consciously freaking out about people "underrating" your players.

Again. Draisaitl is good. He's not worth Jones, to the currently constructed CBJ, a main reason because of PLD.

Other than Panarin, Atkinson is our most dangerous offensive player. Is arguably a better goal scorer than Panarin, and any player on EDM besides McDavid.

I'm happy for you that you still have hope for Puljujarvi. His skating and puck handling are WELL BELOW AVERAGE. These are, most of the time, the 2 main things young players have going for them.
 

zar

Bleed Blue
Sponsor
Oct 9, 2010
7,072
6,493
Edmonton AB
The problem is your idea that I am "underrating" Draisaitl is the same as your idea that I am "overrating" Atiknson, Dubois and (somewhat) Jones. And yet you guys continue to claim its OTHERS underrating the EDM players.

And no it hasn't been Draisaitl "+" in here. Its been Jones "+", or straight up, which again, doesn't help EITHER team. BUT you are disrespected by this thought process as you believe Draisaitl is worth more than Jones and that the CBJ would be dumb to turn that down.

Also to reiterate, Puljujarvi is terrible. Him as a "+" does literally NOTHING for the CBJ.

2 Oiler posters said Jones+ for Draisaitl.

Change Drai to RNH and EDM fans might bite.

Draisaitl will cost Seth Jones+ and neither team is in a position to do that swap.

You want Drai? Start with Jones.

More Oiler posters opposed there being a + on the Jackets side.

Many Oiler posters would say from a talent perspective in their respective positions they are equal. C and D are equally important positions. Jones' contract is clearly more favorable so I would say the Oilers would have to add a decent piece from a total value perspective... something like a 2019 1st (lottery protected).

Saying Puljujarvi sucks is just being ignorant... Atkinson, someone you think very highly of, didn't even play an NHL game until he was 22... Puljujarvi is 19 playing in a country where he just learned the language and on a team that, to say it kindly, had "some challenges" this year.

I do think Dubois is going to be a very good player from what I've seen... I've only watched about 10 games or so.

As far as the OP goes... if you take Puljujarvi out, add a Slepyshev or maybe Khaira... it's fair. Wennberg is a middle of the pack 2C. Atkinson is a 1RW. He is not as young as some might think (29 going into next season), with a new 7 year contract.

It is my preference that if we are trading a talent like Draisaitl, it's with a + for a bonafide #1D. Puck moving a must, RHD preferred.
 
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HenrikW

Registered User
Feb 21, 2018
654
503
Edmonton gets two top6 players instead of one. And Atkinson is a 1st line winger. As far as I understand, Oilers fans are dreaming about to get someone fast and creative and with a scoring touch to play with McDavid. Atkinson is exactly the one.

This is incorrect. We got that sorted now. Thanks
 

yababy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2015
3,441
828
ChaoticOrange said:
You wouldn’t move Jones for Klefbom and Puljujarvi.

You do if you think you can turn Klefbom into Jones, and Puljujarvi into Laine. Knowing that most Oilers are better players elsewhere that deal might be a steal for Columbus

 

Viqsi

"that chick from Ohio"
Oct 5, 2007
53,660
30,952
40N 83W (approx)
Maybe we just want Jones cause he's a beast, future norris winner.
"Maybe we just want McDavid because he's a beast."

Seriously, that is not a productive discussion direction.

* * *​
Swap out Atkinson for Werenski.
That at least makes the hurting more or less equivalent. We still wouldn't go for it, tho; we're built around having that killer top pairing.

* * *​
Yes 57 Is almost 70.

I remember when taylor hall was supposed to bring the second coming of jesus christ in a trade and all he fetched was Adam Larson:laugh:
Okay, seriously, who the hell are you and why are you spouting nonsense to make a bad situation worse?

Yes, sometimes GMs make bad trades. That doesn't make fans of those GMs' teams any more eager to discuss trades in which their teams get ripped off. Pushing that is a jerk move. Don't be a jerk.

* * *​
Oiler players are so great, it's baffling why they lose so much
It happens when you have a small handful of superstars backed by virtually nothing.
 

CupofOil

Knob Flavored Coffey
Aug 20, 2009
46,280
39,510
NYC
Change Drai to RNH and EDM fans might bite.

Draisaitl will cost Seth Jones+ and neither team is in a position to do that swap.

I think the Oilers probably add a bit if it's Jones but yeah, if Drai is being dealt it's either Jones or get out and I'm fully aware that the Jackets wouldn't do it but that's the price that you'd have to pay for the big sexy German.
 

Monk

Registered User
Feb 5, 2008
7,496
5,393
Thread = these 2 teams aren't great trading partners anymore. Howson had a good run.
 
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