Canada Summer Development Camp Feedback?

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HuskyFlames

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With what people are saying in this thread I am starting to like Phaneuf even more each time I read something about him. Hockey news for this month also had a great article about him.

A future defense core of:

Leopold - Regher

Phaneuf - Ramholt

For the Flames will be amazing to watch. I can't wait.
 

db23

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Patrick - Flames Fan said:
With what people are saying in this thread I am starting to like Phaneuf even more each time I read something about him. Hockey news for this month also had a great article about him.

A future defense core of:

Leopold - Regher

Phaneuf - Ramholt

For the Flames will be amazing to watch. I can't wait.

I guess, you see what you want to see, but what I read is that Phaneuf was taking runs at a kid who is 2 years younger and 30 pounds lighter than he was, then got tuned by Colin Fraser who is all of 185 pounds for his efforts. If he runs stars in the NHL, he is going to have to deal with a lot more than Colin Fraser. Nothing I've read about Phaneuf indicates that he can hold his own in a fight. Will he end up as a Matt Cooke/Bryan Marchement type of player who takes runs then turtles?
 

Moskau

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db23 said:
I guess, you see what you want to see, but what I read is that Phaneuf was taking runs at a kid who is 2 years younger and 30 pounds lighter than he was, then got tuned by Colin Fraser who is all of 185 pounds for his efforts. If he runs stars in the NHL, he is going to have to deal with a lot more than Colin Fraser. Nothing I've read about Phaneuf indicates that he can hold his own in a fight. Will he end up as a Matt Cooke/Bryan Marchement type of player who takes runs then turtles?
Marchment can fight, and he's wrecked many peoples faces, even enforcers.

But I have been hearing this about Phaneuf. He will have to learn how to fight for sure.
 

Flames Draft Watcher

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db23 said:
I guess, you see what you want to see, but what I read is that Phaneuf was taking runs at a kid who is 2 years younger and 30 pounds lighter than he was, then got tuned by Colin Fraser who is all of 185 pounds for his efforts. If he runs stars in the NHL, he is going to have to deal with a lot more than Colin Fraser. Nothing I've read about Phaneuf indicates that he can hold his own in a fight. Will he end up as a Matt Cooke/Bryan Marchement type of player who takes runs then turtles?

Kinda jumping to conclusions aren't you there?

Scouting reports on him in his draft year said he holds his own in fights. Personally I haven't seen him fight a lot so I'm not qualified to say.

Have you seen him fight? Are you qualified to be commenting on his fighting ability?
 

sharkyz15

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Moskau said:
Marchment can fight, and he's wrecked many peoples faces, even enforcers.

But I have been hearing this about Phaneuf. He will have to learn how to fight for sure.


WOW so all this hype about him and he's gonna be the next bryan marchment



Have I mentioned that I am very happy the Sharks drafted Milan Michalek
 

Moskau

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sharkyz15 said:
WOW so all this hype about him and he's gonna be the next bryan marchment



Have I mentioned that I am very happy the Sharks drafted Milan Michalek
What?
 

ZombieMatt

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From what I've seen and read from the more credible sources, Phaneuf is NOT a Marchment type of player.

I don't buy into this Phaneuf hype (in fact, I think he's one of the great over-rated prospects on this board along with Parise - both of whom are very good prospects, but not super great as many advertise), but my impressions are this incident are much more so that Phaneuf was actually taking a leadership role, and making an example out of Crosby, saying that it doesn't matter how much hype and talent you have, you're just like everyone else on this team.

Nobody would care if Phaneuf was laying out a lesser profiled player. Heck, Ryan Getzlaf is being heralded by some as a great physical player because he injured Ladd. But because Crosby is the "Next One" (something that I DO actually somewhat agree with), Phanuef is goon squadding it up by going after him.

I don't think so. I think Phaneuf is playing hard nosed hockey again EVERYONE in teh camp, whether they wereon the team last year, expected to go first overall next draft, or the least likely guy in camp to make the team. He's dealing with everyone equally.
 

WADEugottaBELAKthat

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Some Random thoughts after watching all three games and two practices:

Team White
Dion Phaneuf: When paired with Cam barker, combo was virtually impenetrable. It almost seems as though he has spent a couple of years toiling in the buses of the minor leagues. He just appears older, collected, experienced, and tough. It got to the point that by the 3rd game he was overlooking many D-to-D passes and just rushing up the ice with it. Full control.

Cam Barker: Made two mind-boggling outlet passes that spanned half the ice-length to spring breakaways. Smooth on his skates. Didn't play spectacular, but certainly solid. Had excellent chemistry with Phaneuf on the PP.

Brent Seabrook: Scored off a nice wrister after joining the rush in game 3. Besides that, didn't do anything spectacularly good or bad enough to warrent any attention.

Kyle Chipchura: Scored a beauty top-shelf goal. Spent alot of time digging for the puck without any real results. Besides that, mostly invisible.

David Bolland: Showed some big-time puck skills. Makes old-school in-and-out moves to a T. Taking random shots from bad angles to create rebounds is a major part of his offensive strategy. Agressive. Good awareness.

Eric Fehr: Scored two goals in the final game, but seemed to lack aggression throughout the camp. Did not look like a fifty goal scorer by any means Continually got outworked to the puck. Made a couple of bad passing decisions on the PP that led to opposing PK unit icing the puck.

Clarke Macarthur: If the team was picked based on this camp alone, Macarthur would be a no brainer. Got at least a point in each contest. Made Nathan Saunders look ridiculous with a toe-drag move shortly before potting a goal in game 2. Set up Fehr's 1st of game 3 with a nifty 2-on-1 pass. Set a physical tone eraly and often.

Mike Richards: In my opinion, the best overall forward at camp. Has the defensive aspects of the game down pat. Seems to be wherever the puck is. Flat-out difference maker. Loves taking a beating in corners and in front of net (yet, always coming out with the puck). Borderling cheap player. Very good measurer of risk. Cycling skills second to none. Foot speed might be a bit of a concern as far as NHL aspirations are concerned.

Nigel Dawes: Possibly the best offensive player in camp. Yearns to create chemistry with whomever his linemates are - Made Dave Bolland look great in game 1. Is excellent at the transition off the cycle to the slot. Shoots lots (though his wrist/snap shot lacks zzzip). Gets breakaways. Chooses to spend much of his time in open ice, but knows when to be passive and when to get aggressive.

Anthony Stewart: Not much lateral movement. Predominantly an up-and-down winger. Very effective in this role. lacks timing on his hits. Nice reach, but does not have soft hands. Loves the cycle. Fastest player on the ice A-to-B? Strong. Always moving his legs.

Ryan Getzlaf: He only looked good in practice. Wasn't getting any love from the Offence Gods, but scored in game 1. Soft hands. Very Fleet-footed. Confident. Put Hitmen-teammate Andrew Ladd out of camp with shoulder (?) injury.
 

paxtang

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db23 said:
I guess, you see what you want to see, but what I read is that Phaneuf was taking runs at a kid who is 2 years younger and 30 pounds lighter than he was, then got tuned by Colin Fraser who is all of 185 pounds for his efforts. If he runs stars in the NHL, he is going to have to deal with a lot more than Colin Fraser. Nothing I've read about Phaneuf indicates that he can hold his own in a fight. Will he end up as a Matt Cooke/Bryan Marchement type of player who takes runs then turtles?

A) He's not allowed to run Crosby because of his size?

B) While Colin Fraser may be small, he is a good fighter, and a very frequent one. Fraser is no push over. But I guess you just judge fighters by their size. And from the descriptions of this fight, Fraser didn't "tune" anyone. You also have to bring into account that Fraser and Phaneuf are teammates in the WHL, and they just might not want to really go all out with each other.

C) I've read that Phaneuf isn't a great fighter, but can more than hold his own. If he ever turns out ot have the fighting ability of Marchment, than he'd be blessed. Marchment, for all his faults, is a very good fighter, and isn't one to turtle. He's a cheap player, but he'll drop his gloves to back up his hits.
http://dropyourgloves.com/fights/fghtcard.asp?Player=2825&League=1
That's a pretty damn good fight card for a nonenfocer. Cooke is not even close to the player that Marchment is. They might both be cheap *******s, but at least Marchment backs his **** up. But I guess you knew that, before you made some wild claim, right?
 

Levitate

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Nigel Dawes works hard and gets his nose dirty despite his size. Very good skill guy

this is about what i hear of him normally...man if he was even a few inches taller he would be a hot hot prospect

Nigel Dawes: Possibly the best offensive player in camp. Yearns to create chemistry with whomever his linemates are - Made Dave Bolland look great in game 1. Is excellent at the transition off the cycle to the slot. Shoots lots (though his wrist/snap shot lacks zzzip). Gets breakaways. Chooses to spend much of his time in open ice, but knows when to be passive and when to get aggressive.

also good to hear...but i feel like he's still gonna have to work hard to adjust to the the AHL and NHL

still in a few years...hopefully we'll see what he can do
 

WADEugottaBELAKthat

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Some Random thoughts after watching all three games and two practices:

Team Red

Shawn Belle: As advertised, speed is not an issue. However, mental processing abilities might be. It takes him time to get rid of outlet passes, often leaving wingers at the hashmarks vulnerable. Doesn't cover well for his D-partner. Rushes the puck at inopportune times. Didn't look like a returning player.

Braydon Coburn: Never really noticed him until he got into a war of words with Dion Phaneuf in game 2 after coincidental roughing penalties. I would have liked to hear his retort to Phaneuf's comment- "I should have gone 8th Overall" (which didn't really happen). I was expecting a mammoth, but merely got a moth. Simply didn't notice him.

Jeff Schultz: has a nice stride for a big guy. Not overly fast, but covers lots of traffic with his wingspan. Good shot, but slow to get it off. Knows his limitations and plays within them. Played a very physical game in camp. Works hard.

Mike Green: May have had the most embarassing shift out of anyone in camp during game 2 after tripping on a 1-on-1, leaving Alex Picard home free on the tender. This was after taking two successive smack-downs from Clarke Macarthur (they looked painful). Besides that, he's good at keeping the play alive in the offensive end.

Shea Weber: I think he'll make the team. Unlike some of the other D, Weber made some passes and hits that, although not earth shattering, were smart enough to seperate him a little from the pack. Got burned once by Dave Bolland in game 1.

Travis Zajac: It looked like he might have drank some of Lou's Kool-Aid before camp. Tall and rangy, Zajac just seemed positionally inept at times. He's fast, but he was playing perimeter hockey all weekend. He never forsaw the play in order to get into scoring position. Played well in game 2 on a line with Wojtek Wolski and Dany Roussin. Might have lacked confidence in camp - he would often pass up the opportunity to try making a move or a deke to get a weak shot on net or dump the puck deep.

Stefan Meyer: Has white skates.

Dany Roussin: Good head's-up player. Makes the tape-to-tape passes he needs to. Skates like the wind. Often controls the corners.

Jeff Carter: Like Where's Waldo, Carter would intermittently pop out of nowhere. it was usually on 1-on-1's while taking the puck wide. In game one he had six shots on net on one shift, and then dissapeared for the rest of the game. I was really hoping to see more out of him and his line (Crosby and Perry). Carter has a quick release.

Corey Perry: Booooooo. Perry never really went after it. Displayed some smart dangles during practices, but pulled a Houdini during the games. Didn't gel with linemates. Played perimeter hockey. Anytime he went in the corners, he ended up getting manhandled.

Sidney Crosby: I was hoping to see a little more frustration in his face after essentially accomplishing nothing during the week. In practice, he made some passes that reeked of insight and talent. But was a below-average forward during the games. That being said, he was receiving extra attention. But really, if this camp was indicative of what type of player he really is, maybe we should tone it down to a Lafontaine comparison.

Steve Bernier: Fat Bernier looked allright. Apperantly he had the move of the camp in game 1 (while I was taking a deuce). Smart with the puck. Makes use of quick and wide-ranging lateral stickhandling skills. Fast once he gets going. Didn't play in game 3.

Wojtek Wolski: Scored the OT-Shootout game winner in game 2. Knock-knee'd forward was ineffective for large chunks of time, but displayed his silky-soft hands at least once a game. Really tried to make an effort to mesh with Crosby during practice and in game 1. Physical play is not part of his repetoire.

Camp Notes:

-Overall, there was alot of smart hockey being played at this camp. The overall level of play was insightful, fast paced, and aggressive.

-An impressive crowd showed up for the games at Father David Bauer arena. I'd say anywhere from 500-700 people per game. 50 per practice.

-I actually overheard a guy telling his son that Marc-Andre Fleury was in net. it was Ryan Munce. C'mon buddy.

-Alexandre Picard really does bend over when he skates.

-Before the game, teams were warming up in the parking lot 2 hours before puck drop. Team Red played elimination volleyball. Sidney Crosby was the last man standing.
 

db23

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There is a WHL hockey fight board. I don't get much chance to see Phaneuf live, but from what I've read there, he either avoids a fight or doesn't do very well (considering his size and agressiveness) when he does fight. It is one thing to run a guy like Pouliot in an exhibition game (no fear of repercussion), or Olesz in a tournament game (again no fear of repercussion), even a kid like Crosby in scrimmage games, but if he does that in the pros, someone is going to come looking for him. The guy is not likely to be a 185 pounder, either. You KNOW that if Phaneuf injured someone like Mats Naslund, Joe Sakic, Martin St. Louis, or even TRIED TO, the resident goon is going to do some serious damage to him. Not only in that game, but probably every time they meet in the future.

Volchenkov came into the NHL a year ago and tried to make a name for himself taking dangerous runs at players. He managed to stay healthy for a total of 19 games in his second year. Every time he picked himself up off the ice, someone else would blast him. Two concussions, severely separated shoulder....It doesn't take long for the word to get around. It is individual livelyhood and health that is being put at risk by the loose cannons that hit to hurt. Marchement learned to survive and defend himself, but he sure went through a lot of pain and missed a lot of games in doing it.
 
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Behind Enemy Lines

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I agree with alot of Norse Stars' observations but disagree about Eric Fehr. Here's my post from the Oilers site where we have more comments about the Evaluation Camp.


Thursday's scrimmage game saw more running of Sidney Crosby which resulted in Dion Phaneuf scrapping with his Rebel teammate Colin Fraser. Surprising, I give Fraser a slight edge in the fisticuffs.

The standout by far was Eric Fehr. Two goals including a beauty top-shelf laser beam. This kid is the complete package with offensive ability, gritty physical play (despite his current lack of beef), hockey sense, and responsible, defensive ability. A great player in development who I've touted since last year's camp. Got cheap shotted by Coburn in scoring a beauty sixth goal against team red.

I also liked the play of Flamers draft pick Dustin Boyd. This injury replacement player had a very solid game at both ends of the rink - offensive and defensive. Aggressive, strong skating player who is persistent in puck pursuit.

I'll be a buck Wes O'Neill doesn't make this team. Lots of work required for this big guy, beginning with mobility and coordination.

Liking the Hitmen trio of Schultz, Rogers, and Getzlaff. I really like Rogers who displayer good mobility for his size, some tenacity, and very good potential at both ends of the ice. Keeper for Tampa Bay. By the way, Flames Draft Watcher, the Parise/Pouliot debate and my earlier posted comments have been long discussed on this site. I would have happily taken Getzlaff (or Parise, Carter (a non issue at the Oiler pick) or even Belle) before Pouliot. Getzlaff will be a solid pro player.

Chipchura scored a nice goal tonight. Solid tools just has to work on consistency ... easier said than done.

Empty sweaty award to Wojtek Wolski. Didn't know he played except for a very poor and stupid penalty call.
 

Le Golie

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That's the thing about Eric Fehr.

He doesn't look like he's giving 100 per cent. He looks like a lazy player. He's so tall and lanky, he looks akward out there. Then you look back at the game sheet and he's all over it. He really is a great talent but it's the kind of talent you don't easily notice.
 

Brock

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Minnesota Norse Star said:
Some Random thoughts after watching all three games and two practices:


Mike Richards: In my opinion, the best overall forward at camp. Has the defensive aspects of the game down pat. Seems to be wherever the puck is. Flat-out difference maker. Loves taking a beating in corners and in front of net (yet, always coming out with the puck). Borderling cheap player. Very good measurer of risk. Cycling skills second to none. Foot speed might be a bit of a concern as far as NHL aspirations are concerned.

.

His cycling skills are the one thing that really stands out for me with Richards. I honestly have seen very few players control the puck in the offensive zone like Richards. He's so smart, If I was running team Canada's powerplay, Id want him on the ice for the whole two minutes. He's just awesome with puck possession.
 

HuskyFlames

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db23 said:
There is a WHL hockey fight board. I don't get much chance to see Phaneuf live, but from what I've read there, he either avoids a fight or doesn't do very well (considering his size and agressiveness) when he does fight. It is one thing to run a guy like Pouliot in an exhibition game (no fear of repercussion), or Olesz in a tournament game (again no fear of repercussion), even a kid like Crosby in scrimmage games, but if he does that in the pros, someone is going to come looking for him. The guy is not likely to be a 185 pounder, either. You KNOW that if Phaneuf injured someone like Mats Naslund, Joe Sakic, Martin St. Louis, or even TRIED TO, the resident goon is going to do some serious damage to him. Not only in that game, but probably every time they meet in the future.

Volchenkov came into the NHL a year ago and tried to make a name for himself taking dangerous runs at players. He managed to stay healthy for a total of 19 games in his second year. Every time he picked himself up off the ice, someone else would blast him. Two concussions, severely separated shoulder....It doesn't take long for the word to get around. It is individual livelyhood and health that is being put at risk by the loose cannons that hit to hurt. Marchement learned to survive and defend himself, but he sure went through a lot of pain and missed a lot of games in doing it.

And the Flames have guys like Simon that will pound people if other teams enforcers try and make Dion drop the gloves for hits on their star players. It works both ways.
 

paxtang

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Phaneuf fought 10 times last year. I'd expect him to more or less average those kind of numbers in the pros (maybe a little less because he is a D man), which is more than enough for a non enforcer. He'll be fine.
 
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