C/W Jesperi Kotkaniemi - Ässät, Liiga (2018, 3rd, MTL)

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Hockeyisl1fe

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Right now. It's obviously inherently difficult to compare prospects in different draft years playing in different leagues and different levels of hockey. EP was drafted out of the 2nd tier Swedish league, JK played in the top Fininsh league.

But after the insane season EP just had in the SHL, there's no doubt he is the better prospect right now.
I would say Pettersson was a superior prospect even if we compare their draft seasons. I think he was the mvp of Allsvenskan? People underestimate that league too much (basically referring it to be a trash semi pro league, which it isn't). Sure it's not at the level of FEL, but it's still a quality league. Recently some teams in the FEL have started to sign players from there and their production have translated pretty well. For example Erik Thorell scored 50p in 52 games in Allsvenskan, in the following season in the FEL he scored 44p in 56 games.
 
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NotProkofievian

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I would say Pettersson was clearly a superior prospect even if we compare their draft seasons. I think he was the mvp of Allsvenskan? People underestimate that league too much (basically referring it to be a trash semi pro league, which is isn't). Sure it's not at the level of FEL, but it's still a quality league. Recently some teams in the FEL have started to sign players from there and their production have translated pretty well. For example Erik Thorell scored 50p in 52 games in Allsvenskan, in the following season in the FEL he scored 44p in 56 games.

That was Ejdsell. You might be thinking of his linemate and hopefully future teammate Jonathan Dahlen who was the ''best junior'' that year. Agreed with everything else, though.
 

boredmale

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what is career projection ? 2nd or 1sr line player ?

Just my 2 cents Ryan Johansen? And what I mean by that is a guy you could consider a #1 center if you are going by the definition of their needs to be exactly 31 #1 centers but is probably better suited to being in a solid 1-2 punch if your team truly wants a chance to succeed
 

pezcore

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McKenzie on Kotkaniemi: “Lot of scouts told me during the U18’s, my god, he’s looking like Barkov, he can score, makes plays and can play away from the puck. Who wouldn’t like that?”
9:49 AM - Jun 15, 2018
So much confusion and turmoil now with comments like these. I was on the Zadina bandwagon but if this guy is a Barkov type of center, Habs has to pick that guy.

I know his biggest flaw is skating but how bad is it? Zadina's isnt so great either but how would you compare these aspect between the 2 players:

Skating
Shot
Hands
IQ
Play without the puck
Defensive awareness
Compete level
Character (cuz MB loves that)

Im sure Zadina has the edge on shooting and hands but Im clueless with the rest since I havent seen much of Kotkaniemi. Anyone want to chime in?
 

JeffreyLFC

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So much confusion and turmoil now with comments like these. I was on the Zadina bandwagon but if this guy is a Barkov type of center, Habs has to pick that guy.

I know his biggest flaw is skating but how bad is it? Zadina's isnt so great either but how would you compare these aspect between the 2 players:

Skating
Shot
Hands
IQ
Play without the puck
Defensive awareness
Compete level
Character (cuz MB loves that)

Im sure Zadina has the edge on shooting and hands but Im clueless with the rest since I havent seen much of Kotkaniemi. Anyone want to chime in?
Skating: Zadina
Shot : Zadina
Hands : Zadina
IQ: Kotkaniemi
Playwithout puck: Kotkaniemi
Defensive awareness: Kotkaniemi
Compete level : Kotkaniemi
Character: Kotkaniemi
 

ProspectsFanatic

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Nov 13, 2012
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Skating: Zadina
Shot : Zadina
Hands : Zadina
IQ: Kotkaniemi
Playwithout puck: Kotkaniemi
Defensive awareness: Kotkaniemi
Compete level : Kotkaniemi
Character: Kotkaniemi

Speed: Kotkaniemi
Edge work: Zadina
Shot : Zadina
Hands : Zadina
IQ: Kotkaniemi
Defensive awareness: Kotkaniemi
Compete level: Kotkaniemi/Zadina
Age/Potential growth: Kotkaniemi
Size: Kotkaniemi
 
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JeffreyLFC

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Well it's also very weird to compare one for one.

Zadina is not a dynamic skater but he is very agile.

Kotkaniemi is not the best skater around but he is almost impossible to knock off and he moves well enough.

Zadina shot is top 3 in the draft but Kotkaniemi also has a laser of a shot.

Hands Zadina has probably exhibited his hands more but Kotkaniemi also has great hands.
 

Critical13

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Sitting at a desk.
Speed: Kotkaniemi
Edge work: Zadina
Shot : Zadina
Hands : Zadina
IQ: Kotkaniemi
Defensive awareness: Kotkaniemi
Compete level/Character: Kotkaniemi/Zadina
Age/Potential growth: Kotkaniemi
Size: Kotkaniemi
Why does Kot have more compete? I've never seen Zadina play a shift where he isn't hounding. Also, why does Zadina have an advantage in Character? We know almost nothing about these kids?

Some confusing choices here, seems to be based on very little.
 

ProspectsFanatic

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Why does Kot have more compete? I've never seen Zadina play a shift where he isn't hounding. Also, why does Zadina have an advantage in Character? We know almost nothing about these kids?

Some confusing choices here, seems to be based on very little.

No I meant they are about equal Compete level & Character wise, I see how it can be confusing though, I fixed it.
 
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Hockeyisl1fe

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That was Ejdsell. You might be thinking of his linemate and hopefully future teammate Jonathan Dahlen who was the ''best junior'' that year. Agreed with everything else, though.
Could have mixed them up, but I remember him winning some sort of award there. Did he won the playoffs mvp award?
 

NotProkofievian

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Could have mixed them up, but I remember him winning some sort of award there. Did he won the playoffs mvp award?

He might have. EP isn't the be all end all, and I don't speak swedish so I can't search directly, but they don't have anything from Allsvenskan besides ''most assists (junior)'' for him.
 

Walshy7

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Sep 18, 2016
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Well, checking the 1st round drafts from 2010 on:

Joel Armia (16th) is a decent grinder with hot streaks here and there, but overall not really a 1st round level guy.
Kasperi Kapanen (22nd) is still behind the curve, even after 2 full seasons (+1 season of 9 games), not really a first rounder.
Jesse Puljujärvi (4th) is dangerously close to a total bust, compared to being a 4th pick. If he doesn't break out in 2018-19, he'll probably be traded somewhere and if that doesn't work, he'll be overseas for good.

Bonus:
Ville Pokka (2nd, 34th) didn't even get a chance and has now moved back overseas.

I love kapanen and would very easily pick him in the 1st round. You can not teach that speed, and we haven't given him a chance up the lineup in a scoring role yet that's not his fault we are stacked on the wings
 

BB88

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A prospect should have to earn his ice time, not just get it because their daddy is the head coach. Anyone who has played junior hockey, when some kid's dad is the coach would know this.

He was 3rd on his team in scoring, despite being 17y.

He's earned that shot, to me it's a good thing his father is the coach, they should have a good idea where he is and where he needs to get.
 

Matias Maccete

Chopping up defenses
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Unless there are buy-out issues, the only players restricted from playing in the AHL immediately after their draft is players who play in the CHL.
Isn't it only players drafted into the CHL out of Canada or something like that as well? Players loaned to a CHL team can go to the AHL right after they're drafted right?
 

93LEAFS

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Isn't it only players drafted into the CHL out of Canada or something like that as well? Players loaned to a CHL team can go to the AHL right after they're drafted right?
There is a small loophole that can be used where if a player was loaned to the CHL by a Euro club, it doesn't apply. It most notably happened with Honka and Alex Nylander. Still fairly rare to see. I don't think any big name Euro's in the CHL this year are on loan. Svechnikov isn't (not that it will really matter) and neither is Zadina.
 

Matias Maccete

Chopping up defenses
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There is a small loophole that can be used where if a player was loaned to the CHL by a Euro club, it doesn't apply. It most notably happened with Honka and Alex Nylander. Still fairly rare to see. I don't think any big name Euro's in the CHL this year are on loan. Svechnikov isn't (not that it will really matter) and neither is Zadina.
Interesting thanks, so why are Svech and Zadina different, were they drafted into the CHL rather than loaned to the specific club? If Brady Tkachuk went to London next year, would be AHl eligible in his draft +2 year?
 

Dr Jan Itor

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A prospect should have to earn his ice time, not just get it because their daddy is the head coach. Anyone who has played junior hockey, when some kid's dad is the coach would know this.

He was 3rd on the team in scoring this year. I think the ice time will be plenty earned.
 

93LEAFS

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Interesting thanks, so why are Svech and Zadina different, were they drafted into the CHL rather than loaned to the specific club? If Brady Tkachuk went to London next year, would be AHl eligible in his draft +2 year?
Okay. there are a couple of questions here, and I'll try to answer them with an explanation and an example.

In Svech's case, he got out of his Russia deal and went to the USHL, and was then drafted in the import draft. He didn't even come to the CHL through a Euro club.

Zadina was outright drafted in the Import draft and signed with the team after terminating his deal in the Czech Republic. He didn't have a valid Czech contract when he came over. Players who can be considered loaned need to be loaned by a team in Europe that they have a valid contract with. Zadina could have done this if his agent structured it that way and Halifax was willing. Certain CHL teams are significantly more desirable to Euros such as Halifax and London, so they can say they won't draft them or take them in that type of deal. In Nylander's case, I feel the team was desperate (as shown by their willingness to hire the dad as a coach), so they were willing to structure the deal in any way. William was just drafted by Toronto, and Sauga isn't a very successful franchise, so I assume their hope was they could bring up attendance through the name association.

Firstly, Brady Tkachuk is a late-birthday. Even if he was drafted from the Knights this year, he could play in the AHL in 2019-20 (for example like Lucas Johansen could this year, while Mikey McLeod couldn't). Now, any player drafted out of a non-CHL league but plays their first post-draft year there can enter the AHL for their 19-year-old year. For example, if Wahlstrom decided to play in the CHL next year after being drafted out of the USHL, could enter the AHL at 19, a clear example of this would be Sonny Milano in the 2015/16 season playing in the AHL despite being 19 and playing in the CHL at 18.

So, basic rules of thumb. any player drafted out of CHL has to play their 18 and 19 year old in the CHL. Unless they are a rare exception like Nylander and Honka ( a new trend agents may pick up on), but still highly uncommon.

If drafted from anywhere else, they can play in the AHL immediately, depending on the contract status they have in their region (this is especially tricky with Russians).

If a player is drafted and goes to the CHL post draft, they are free to leave at any-time.
 
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