Discussion in 'Wrestling' started by KaseMeOutside, Apr 9, 2018.
Clearly you do since you took the time to respond
WWE didn't let go of Daniel Bryan?
Ya in 2010, he wasn't the star he is now
2 he's not the star Lesnar is
Right, which is why he had the crowd eating out of the palm of his hand after being away from the ring for more than 3 years after last night.
Lesnar is an anti-draw at this point. Those boos were aimed at him last nigh, albeit not as much as Reigns.
of course they did they hadn't seen Bryan wrestle in 3 years That's to be expected they'd do the same Cody returned or Omega debuted doesn't mean they are bigger stars than Brock
I've posted countless times going back to the old boards how Daniel Bryan is legitimately the biggest draw in the company of full-time guys. In fact, I believe once it was directed at you for making a similar argument that you are now.
The fact is Daniel Bryan's RTWM back where he ultimately faced HHH, Orton and Batista in the same night had the highest ratings for the RTWM since The Rock's return, with every year around those two being declining years. Daniel Bryan being in the title picture in the fall of that prior year had the largest fall TV ratings WWE had seen in years up to that point, reversing the declining trend, where the WWE champion at the time, Randy Orton, was in the 9:30 timeslot because he couldn't draw or retain viewers to save his life (the literal anti-draw was losing viewers at the top of the hour).
Daniel Bryan was drawing and keeping the most viewers. Daniel Bryan's return had more mainstream exposure than Brock Lesnar has had in the WWE since ending the streak (not including crossing over to fight in UFC and his ultimate USADA drug failure).
yeah but he was also moving way too much merchandise befire retirement.
Bryan is bigger for /wwe than Brock. lets stop arguing that.
That's exactly the point I'm making. Bryan moves the needle. He legitimately shifts the numbers and changes patterns upwards. He's legit money. He's proven it time and time again since about 2013.
Unless that wasn't directed at me in which case, never mind lol
Lesnar is an anti draw? Come on...
it was at the post before.
edit:this one too)
It absolutely amazes me how this narrative formed over the past two days that this Mania main event disaster isn’t Roman’s fault, or Vince’s for stubbornly pushing Roman again.
Not it is selfish Brock’s fault. He ruined the coranation. Roman going over Joe will be much better received.
I hate having to defend Brock because he is really a dick. Fact is when he cares and sees money, he is super entertaining. We saw that with Joe. That should have been a three match showcase. He didn’t care about this feud and for good reason.
You can still get good value out of Brock if you book him right, and handicapping him to this failed Roman push isn’t it.
The character of Roman Reigns needs to end. The guy needs time away and needs to be repackaged. I feel awful for him too. He seems like a legit good guy, and he is a talented wrestler. Vince has just saddled so much crap on him he will never recover from.
Lol, you can not like Lesnar all you want. I think his schtick has gotten old and he needs a change. He's still a draw. And while Bryan is certainly the biggest draw to the wrestling audience, Brock is a draw outside of the wrestling audience.
see I dont even think he does that anymore. he's been back for 5 years now. the interest factor of "wow, Brock is wrestling again" has long since died. He doesn't move the non wrestling news needle anymore, he's just seen as another wrestler to non fans.
Rousey has that crown now. Everything she has done in the WM build up made non wrestling news because it was still new and novel.
I'm at the point with Brock where the build to the matches are fine with Paul running down his next opponent but the matches themselves are just bland because there's no real story to them. It's like watching a little kid play with his action figures...just slam them together and make noises.
After watching Mania, Ronda was better telling a story in the ring and using her MMA chops in her match. Brock just tossing dudes over his head does nothing for me. I thought the guy actually had a more complete move set in his earlier run with the company.
Brock is too cartoonishly strong and powerful that I don't ever believe someone is actually hanging with him in the ring. His match with Joe and even A.J. were at least passable. The multi-man matches are just there so guys can get high spots on each other and rest between moves. Brock seemingly gets wrecked in all those matches and sits out until the end and wins with an F5. The rest of the guys in the match do all the work.
I'm not full-on apathetic towards him but I won't miss him when eventually leaves. I want to see legit feuds for the Universal title soon...even if it involves Roman.
Danielson didn’t move numbers, he was just the most over face.
Paul Heyman has resigned with the WWE as well. It's noted that Heyman's contract is a short-term contract, possibly indicating that Brock's deal is a short-term deal as well.
I can't stand Brock so much that I was actually upset that Roman didn't win the title at Mania. At least with Roman, there's always the chance for a heel turn that could completely save him. Brock just brings with him terrible feuds that look like reruns and a crappy 5 min match at a PPV. Oh, he also makes me hate Heyman and his promos by association.
But he did. And I posted evidence of such with numbers on the old board before migration years ago.
Fall ratings reversed their declining stage from the months he was in the title picture.
RTWM ratings reversed the declining trend when he was main eventing.
Merchandise was a top seller.
And just this year alone his announcement reportedly pushed Wrestlemania to a (near) sell out (within less than 1000 tickets) after their ticket sales were struggling.
To suggest Bryan doesn’t move numbers is an incredible disservice to him and discrediting exactly how popular he is.
A few years ago, sure. There’s no denying that. Now? Hard pressed to debate that he is. Don’t forget the “YES” chant becoming a pop culture phenomenon was all under Bryan’s watch on the RTWM.
NBA, NHL, schools, college sports, ESPN coverage. They were all adopting the “Yes” chant.
They were adopting the chant, but were they buying PPVs? Probably not.
I don't really think it's fair to use the PPV buys argument because the "Yes" chant was going mainstream when the WWE Network launched.
But when it comes to generating money, Bryan's merchandise was the #2 seller (behind Cena) at live events and #3 seller (behind Cena and Punk) in late 2013/early 2014 (before Punk left). Lesnar's obviously sold a lot of merch too (I don't have recent numbers).
There's no denying that Lesnar was a big mainstream draw and legitimately brought in money (hell, I want to a house show SOLELY because he was announced for it). He had just come from the UFC. I think that draw has diminished in recent years, though, and I think now with his return, Bryan can be someone that'll draw in more viewers and interest than Lesnar at this point. IMO, if Lesnar is going to become an attraction and mainstream draw again, he's going to need to: a) win a UFC fight in 2018 and NOT fail a drug test again, and b) please stop Suplex City. This guy is a once in a lifetime athlete. The formula worked, but I think people just get bored and turn off Lesnar because it's the same thing.
I'm pretty sure quite a few of them were.
Smackdown just did their lowest number of the year last week and didn’t crack 3 million when Danielson made the announcement that everyone either knew was coming or was anticipating it upon his clearance.
But on the other end of the spectrum, the Smackdown on the day Bryan got cleared had their highest rating and viewership numbers in 11 years.