Best Canadian/American replacements?

Discussion in 'The Business of Hockey' started by Other Dave, Feb 14, 2005.

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  1. Other Dave

    Other Dave Registered User

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    There's been boundless enthusiasm lately for the prospect of replacement players wearing the laundry of the pros. Who is it we're talking about here? Who are the top 100, say, in Canada and the top 100 in the US?

    For the sake of argument, let's assume that Players' Association members won't cross a picket line, so no NHLPA, or PHPA players please.
     
  2. eye

    eye Registered User

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    200 players on 12 teams. Not that hard to imagine.

    Why no PHPA players? I also think that players on NHL 2 ways have an out to play in the New NHL as they are all or mostly currently still playing in the AHL under their NHL contracts. Add in all recently drafted prospects that have been signed and this league could be very good.
     
  3. StickShift

    StickShift Registered User

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    Corey Hirsch is going to *rock*
     
  4. nyr7andcounting

    nyr7andcounting Registered User

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    I'll be playing for the Rangers, watch out for me.
     
  5. Other Dave

    Other Dave Registered User

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    Which ones?

    Rob Valicevic?

    Call it an exercise. Assume that the PHPA will stand in solidarity with their brother union.

    I think it's a big assumption that players with a good shot at an NHL career ahead of them will cross the line. Is this what the fans are banking their hopes on? I do agree that the best hope the owners have of achieving their goals and breaking the union is to have players defect en masse. But what if they don't? What are the starting lineups of the 30 teams at training camp?
     
  6. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

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    Think of this as audtion for many of these AHL players, and I guarentee that some will in fact stick with the main club based on their preformance if the replacement games go on for any length of time. As I have seen said before the top percent of the AHL are fairly interchangable with the bottom percent of the NHL, how much talent does it take to clutch and grab? . . .someone mentioned a 60% figure as fairly interchangable once, I am not sure about that, but I am sure that all but the top quarter of players have to have some worry at the real prospect of some of them, perhaps them, being passed by and losing their jobs.
     
  7. Other Dave

    Other Dave Registered User

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    AHL players are all PHPA members. What if they don't cross? Who are the best of the remaining Canadian and American players?
     
  8. ti-vite

    ti-vite Registered User

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    If anyone, then my 'dream' scab team is (no particular postion BTW):

    Line #1: Lonny Bohonos ,Kevin Kerr, Sidney Crosby (lol)
    Line #2: Pierre Dagenais, Rob Ray, Juraj Kolnik
    Line #3: Steve Maltais, Jeremy Roenick (with wine), Stephane Lebeau
    Spare: Thomas, Madden


    Def: Mike Comodore, Pothier, Ference, Christian Dubé, (???)

    Goalie: Healy, er I mean Esche, uh I mean Hirsh...

    I wonder if Mario Lemieux would cross...
     
  9. I'm not sure what the idea behind this exercise is? Is it to prove that the majority of the fans here don't follow the minors very much and would not know any of the players in the non-affiliated north american and european leagues? What's the point?

    I also don't see the point in saying that NHLPA and PHPA members would not cross the picket line. Its a given that there will be a percentage of the membership crossing the line. All it is going to take is the NHL's version of Joe Montana crossing the line and I think you will see the union fail on a massive scale, except for a few players who will be too embarassed to show their faces in a NHL jersey because of comments made during the lockout (Guerin, Pronger, McCabe, etc.). So I have no reason to see why these players should not be considered.
     
  10. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

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    I doubt that the NHLPA could keep 50% of its members from crossing let alone AHL players. The union seems to be fracturing as it is, this will be the first chance to give rank and file members rather than the elite running the show a chance to 'vote', which I predict that they will do, en mass, by crossing the picket lines.

    And yes ti-vite, Mario would play, why would he not? His sole 'earnings' from that nullified by the bankruptcy court $30 million contract that Howard Baldwin gave him is the franchise value of the Pens. He has 30 million reasons to cross.
     
  11. ti-vite

    ti-vite Registered User

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    Ok, then Id put Mario as coach.

    hehe
     
  12. eye

    eye Registered User

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    PHPA is an Association not a Union. PHPA members are usually on one year contracts that are not guaranteed so they will jump at the chance to play in the NHL even if it's only for a short time. A short time could turn into a long time if Goodenow is still in charge of getting a deal done.

    Also, why would PHPA members support NHLPA members after taking several jobs away from them this year in the AHL, UHL, CHL and ECHL?
     
  13. CGG

    CGG Registered User

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    For replacements to happen (which is a longshot at best) the players would first have to vote to go on strike. In effect, a vote to turn down the league's latest impasse offer. More than 50% would have to vote to strike, otherwise it would be de facto accepted. So if there are replacements, by definition, fewer than 50% would cross. I doubt you would see any kind of significant number of players cross, but everyone around here seems to assume that the overwhelming majority of PA members are secretly in favour of the league's position. I don't think I need to point out how horribly flawed that argument is.

    Back to the point of the thread, you would have to get Canadian players who went to Europe before the lockout to come back. The Stephan Lebeau's of the world. The US would be harder, there's nowhere near enough to fill 24 teams.
     
  14. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

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    I am under no delusion that the majority of the players 'support' the owner's position, but I do truly believe that a majority at this point would accept it, some out of fear of losing their jobs, some who can add 2 and 2 and see that the percent to divide is much smaller now than it would have been five months ago and is even going to get worse so there is no way for them to 'win'.
     
  15. Other Dave

    Other Dave Registered User

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    According to most fans, the players were crazy not to have caved in straight away. What if they continue to defy expectations and hold out? Many fans have stated uniquivocally that they would cheer the laundry no matter who the teams would dress. I'm just trying to get a sense if *anyone* knows who that might be, should the players continue to stand fast.

    Among other things, yeah. I'm willing to bet that an NHL effort that features only a handful of the top 500 or so players in North America, and many who are only marginal players in even the most marginal of pro leagues, will fail miserably at the gate.
     
  16. Trottier

    Trottier Very Random

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    :lol :joker: :lol: :handclap:

    And better yet, some will pay to watch you! :lol
     
  17. I'm not sure I buy that. I think the NHL players that have taken up residence in the UHL are surprised by the quality of play in the league and are not dominating to the extent they thought they would. I also believe that "known" players is not a huge deal when all teams are working from the same starting point. Players become stars because the fans make them so. With a new bunch of players new fan favorites will evolve and new stars will be discovered. Sure, they may not be on the skill level as the NHL players of a few years ago, but when all is said and done they are star players at the new NHL level and will likely be embraced just as the old stars were. The longer the old NHL players stay on the other side of the line and the longer the new players get a chance to develop a following, the more likely it is that the old NHL players become a foot note in league history. This is the exact strategy that brought the NFLPA crawling back on their bellies. The same will work here. Players will cross because they do not want to take a chance of not getting the adoration they feel is rightfully theirs and will want to protect their turf.
     
  18. no13matssundin

    no13matssundin Registered User

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    FINALLY!!

    Lonny Bohonos will sport the Blue & White AGAIN!!! :handclap:
     
  19. dakota

    dakota Registered User

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    i am sure a lot of UHL guys would love to come play in the NHL under the new CBA guaranteeing them 1.3 million per... this could be the best thing that ever happened to them...

    also many in the CBC broadcast about the hockey tryouts that those guys would probably be eager to play I dont know how many were in the training camp - about 100 I think and most were pretty decent...
     
  20. PecaFan

    PecaFan Registered User

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    Ah yes, the old "If we don't know the names, then no one will watch" theory.

    It doesn't matter what the names are. Sorry, that's just the way things are. At one point, every single player in the NHL right now was an unknown name. A player you'd never heard of.

    I had no idea who Mark Kirton was. Watched and enjoyed him. Gary Lupul. Paul Popiel. Even a new kid, called Trevor Linden. The names go on and on.
     
  21. jb**

    jb** Guest

    You will probably get a lot of europeans who played hear for a cup of coffee and didn't make it: Robert Dome, Patrick Juhlin, older players as well
     
  22. IcemanTBI

    IcemanTBI Registered User

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    No, Euro's won't be allowed to play as replacements because of immigration laws. Canadian teams would have to be filled with Canadian citizens, American teams would have to be filled with US citizens.
     
  23. kenabnrmal

    kenabnrmal Registered User

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    I just can't see how the replacement player route is going to work for the league. I'm no expert, but it just seems riddled with obstacles.
     
  24. dakota

    dakota Registered User

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    With only canadians being allowed to play the Canucks might actually be able to win a Stanley Cup ... can Brule play for Van? what about the undrafted guys? Crosby etc.,? are they elligible? What about the europeans who are currently undrafted who are playing in Canada in juniors? what if the NHL has impasse and holds the draft... what about those drafted players?
     
  25. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

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    For those who say that few NHL players will cross, inside the mind of one NHL Player:

    Blake finally hit the jackpot with the Islanders. His scrappy, blue-collar style was a hit with fans. He was producing big numbers. He'd signed a three-year contract in August reportedly worth $6 million.

    Taking everything into consideration -- the road he'd traveled to get the big payoff -- Blake just might be the player hurt most by the machinations of Gary Bettman and Bob Goodenow.

    That's the bad news. There might be worse news.

    "It's at a scary point right now for the players," Blake said. "This season's gone and it looks like the same deal is going to be on the table in the summer or next fall or whenever the next meetings are scheduled. Something needs to change. If the players think the owners are suddenly going to say, 'OK, let's give them what they want,' I just don't see that happening."

    It won't. Not in Blake's lifetime. Not in Blake's children's lifetimes. Not in the lifetimes of Blake's grandchildren. The owners instead will wait it out, content to flush next season without losing a wink of sleep.

    Yes, the NHL wants a salary cap. It would be more elated to bust the union.

    The owners would never acknowledge it, of course, but it's clearly part of their thinking. Who can say they won't succeed? Hockey players, maybe more than athletes in any of the professional sports, just want to play their game. It's more than strictly a way to make big money. It's a passion, a way of life.

    Hockey players might be the most likely to cross their union picket lines. It's a possibility Blake did not dismiss.

    "We're tight as a union, but there's going to have to come a point where players start wondering," Blake said. "I can't see how guys can sit out a year, two years and think it's OK. There comes a time when you have to think of yourself, your family. A career is so short, the window is so small.

    "I don't want to be sitting home next September wondering if there's going to be a season. Do I want to miss two years of the prime of my career? Financially I'll never get that back. And I'm not getting any younger."


    http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=83379&section=Columnists&columnist=Mike McFeely
     
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