Bell Centre and the ACC

[arrbez]

i can't remember toronto ever having one of the loudest buildings, especially since the ACC was built, so it's really no surprise to me. i was at the game, and i dont think it was nearly as bad as everyone seems to think, but it certainly wasnt as loud as montreal. but then again, toronto rarely is as loud as a lot of the other hockey cities

 

[Johnny]

i can't remember toronto ever having one of the loudest buildings, especially since the ACC was built, so it's really no surprise to me. i was at the game, and i dont think it was nearly as bad as everyone seems to think, but it certainly wasnt as loud as montreal. but then again, toronto rarely is as loud as a lot of the other hockey cities

Yes, and if noise was the be all and end all to defining a hockey city, Chicago would go down as one of the all time great hockey cities as the old Chicago stadium also known as the madhouse on Madison used to be regarded as the loudest building in the league...Many building's south of the border have also been quite loud at times, yet aren't exactly what you would call hockey hot beds... Noise is one aspect.

 

[High flyin' Habs*]

Yes, and if noise was the be all and end all to defining a hockey city, Chicago would go down as one of the all time great hockey cities as the old Chicago stadium also known as the madhouse on Madison used to be regarded as the loudest building in the league...Many building's south of the border have also been quite loud at times, yet aren't exactly what you would call hockey hot beds... Noise is one aspect.

I thought this thread was about the Bell center being louder than the Acc not about which city's are hockey hot beds?

 

[Johnny]

I thought this thread was about the Bell center being louder than the Acc not about which city's are hockey hot beds?

Yeah, well you can thank your fellow Hab fan who felt it was necessary to proclaim Montreal as the "true hockey town" in a topic that was meant to discuss noise level... I also see those (which may or not apply directly to this particular thread) who question Toronto also as a hockey town because the fans aren't loud enough at the ACC, which I find unfair, ridiculous, and just because I'm a honest guy, flat out stupid.

 

[Killer 93]

i can't remember toronto ever having one of the loudest buildings, especially since the ACC was built, so it's really no surprise to me. i was at the game, and i dont think it was nearly as bad as everyone seems to think, but it certainly wasnt as loud as montreal. but then again, toronto rarely is as loud as a lot of the other hockey cities

You are right. We have never been loud. Maple Leaf Gardens was called "The Library" for a reason.

 

[High flyin' Habs*]

Good post. I think those three points really sum it up quite nicely, although I'm not so sure about the first one; I mean, how much difference can a couple thousand fans make?

The corporate pandering argument has been brought up time and time again, and it's a valid one. But, and I say this as a born and raised Torontonian (old city - not this GTA crap), even without the corporate element, I question whether Toronto could reach the vocal heights of its Montreal counterpart. As stated in the post above, the difference between Leaf crowds and Hab crowds is not only a matter of which part of the city shows up, but the cities themselves.

Montreal's civic culture and Toronto's civic culture are miles apart. If you were to take a snapshot of what can be considered the quintisential 'Toronto lifestyle/outlook/attitude' and compare it to that of Montreal, what you'd get is simple: Business vs Fun. Toronto is a much more corporate centred city. The average Torontonian can usually be found to be more high strung, serious, and with a eye towards time and the best way to use that time. The average Montrealer, on the other hand, is more likely to take life as it comes. More laid back, more with an eye towards fun.

These differences can be seen in both city's sporting realms. This issue has nothing to do with passion or how much each town loves Hockey. Both are fairly equal. What it does have to do with it how each city expresses that passion. Montrealers are much more outgoing and laid back - hence, they are more prone to public outbursts of emotion. Torontonians on the other hand are not used to such jovial expressions of love and devotion to their sports team; theirs is a more private, more subtle relationship with their team and with the sport.

Above all, it should be stressed that noise does not = passion. They are not one in the same. Hence, this is not an issue of passion, but of expression (am I repeating myself?).

I also think Montreal is more comfortable with itself as a self-sustaining society. Montrealers, and Quebecers, have been able to create their own culture to a large extent - their own musicians, their own movies, their own TV, their own taste in sports. Toronto, like much of central English Canada, does also have it's own culture/taste, but is not as secure in this sense. Torontonians are used to looking to the States for their fare. This is why natives of Toronto have been saddled with the stereotype of being fickle and of only following trends. If it's not big and not accepted by Americans, it's not cool. Case in point: The Argos.

Toronto has the honour of playing home to the oldest, and one of the most historic sports organizations in North America, yet somehow, this team is seen as 'uncool'. It is not embraced and is not well supported. When ever rumours of NFL Northern expansion pop-up, we always hear from a strong contingent of Torontonians pushing for the Argos to go bust, just so the NFL can make its way into town. How pathetic. These people want to see a storied, historic organization go by the way side just so they can indulge in the 'cool' American alternative. This right here sums up the average Torontonians insecurity with anything not accepted outside their own boundries. They can not be comfortable with their own tastes, their own culture - even if those tastes and culture are to be very proud of (in this case, the Argos).

You would never see this in Montreal. Montrealers often partake in activities and arts that no one outside of Quebec even knows about. They are comfortable with themselves, they are proud of who they are, and hence, quite frankly, don't give a flying f*ck what anyone else thinks.

How does this relate to Hockey crowds?

Quite simply, Montrealers are more comfortable with themselves, and hence are more comfortable, and more accustom to expressing their pride in loud, boisterous ways. Torontonians are too used to being spoon fed by American culture. They don't know how to act on their own pride. They tippy toe around what they partake in, always afraid that somehow it's not cool enough and that they will not be seen as "world class" for enjoying it.

This is not to say Torontonians are apprehensive about their relationship to the Leafs. Not at all! If there's one aspect of Torontonian civic culture that can be compared to Montreal in their confidence and pride, it's Hockey and the Leafs! But it seems that this laid back, shy, insecure attitude has unfortunately seeped in to the way Torontonians express this pride in the Leafs and Hockey.


I realize I've gone on too long. I also realize this is a very vague and probably bizzare theory. It's all general thoughts written down off the top of my head, so if I come off a little nuts, I apologize.

Great point.

 

[syc]

Courtesy of Bob McKenzie:

http://tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie.asp

----------------------------------------------------

There was a huge difference in the Toronto crowd compared to Montreal. I say this as a hockey fan born and raised in Toronto - there was no comparison in the atmosphere. Montreal was much more raucous. It was not even close in Toronto.

The players noticed it, too. Everybody noticed it.

I was surprised the difference was so great. Now, there is no question that fans at the Air Canada Centre love their Maple Leafs, but Toronto has not been home to much international hockey in the past, so maybe they just had trouble cheering for the red Maple Leaf instead of the blue one. It's really unfortunate, because Canada will play the balance of its schedule in Toronto, and they seem to get a better reception in Montreal.

----------------------------------------------------

Come on TO, get your act together!

I don't think its that montreal fans are better fans then TO fans. It's just that french people in general are cocky loud mouthed people when compared to the rest of canada.

Whats up with the lame soccer song at a hockey game anyways?

 

[High flyin' Habs*]

I don't think its that montreal fans are better fans then TO fans. It's just that french people in general are cocky loud mouthed people when compared to the rest of canada.

Whats up with the lame soccer song at a hockey game anyways?

Who says its a soccr song? Fans at the Molson/Bell center have been singing that song since I can remember.

 

[gohabsgo2010]

I don't think its that montreal fans are better fans then TO fans. It's just that french people in general are cocky loud mouthed people when compared to the rest of canada.

Whats up with the lame soccer song at a hockey game anyways?

Chanting a soccer song kicks the **** out of sitting beside a fat man in a suit drinking tea and clapping queerly whenever his team makes a good play. That's what it's like at the ACC.

 

[Westlander]

I think that with the possible exception of the playoffs, Montreal does have a better atmosphere than Toronto, and as others have mentioned, it has mostly to do with the culture, and the type of people who attend games in Montreal versus those in Toronto. I've even seen the exact same difference in Expos and Jays games, where 25,000 at the Big O make more noise than 50,000 at the Dome (not that either team draws those numbers anymore) And I say all this as a die-hard Leaf fan. As a matter of fact, the loudest Leaf fans I have ever heard are when I have gone to see Toronto play on the road in either Montreal or Ottawa.

As far as which city is the hockey capital of the world, every Canadian NHL city is going to militantly insist that they have the best fans, so I'm not sure that's a good measuring stick. I have read that the city of Toronto has produced more NHL players than any other city in the world. That should count for something!

I think as the games get more important, the atmosphere at the ACC should improve somewhat, but perhaps for the next WC, the final should be back in Montreal again.

 

[Johnny]

but perhaps for the next WC, the final should be back in Montreal again.

Yeah, maybe, thats if they dont boo when things dont go the way they want and litter the ice again, as SwisshockeyAcademy mentioned... I see people saying that it's too bad the finals weren't played in Montreal, after the memory was refreshed of that disgusting display, I say good... Just my MO though...

EDIT, and if TO acts in a smilar disgraceful way if Team Canada happens to face some adversity comparable, I will be the first to say that TO deserves no part in the next World Cup.

 

[Westlander]

Yeah, maybe, thats if they dont boo when things dont go the way they want and litter the ice again, as SwisshockeyAcademy mentioned... I see people saying that it's too bad the finals weren't played in Montreal, after the memory was refreshed of that disgusting display, I say good... Just my MO though...

You're right in that Montreal fans are a lot more harsh when things aren't going well, but I expect they would go easier on Team Canada than they would on the Habs if we somehow crash out of this tournament. However I don't expect that will happen.

And we should wait to see how the rest of the games go at the ACC before judging Toronto.

 

[Bill McNeal]

I don't think its that montreal fans are better fans then TO fans. It's just that french people in general are cocky loud mouthed people when compared to the rest of canada.

Whats up with the lame soccer song at a hockey game anyways?

Wow. Great post. I mean, really. You cracked this one wide open.

I won't even comment on your french remarks because they're just ignorant, but on the subject of the soccer song: God forbid people have fun, eh? Let's just sit around and wait for the jumbotron to tell us what to do...

 

[Johnny]

but I expect they would go easier on Team Canada than they would on the Habs if we somehow crash out of this tournament. However I don't expect that will happen.
.

I dont know if it could get any worse then what SwisshokceyAcademy described, but, if so, I feel sorry for those Habs... On second thought, no I dont, keep booing those Habs I'd boo them too

 

[mcphee]

I don't think its that montreal fans are better fans then TO fans. It's just that french people in general are cocky loud mouthed people when compared to the rest of canada.

Whats up with the lame soccer song at a hockey game anyways?

You're a sad little man.

 

[Westlander]

I dont know if it could get any worse then what SwisshokceyAcademy described, but, if so, I feel sorry for those Habs... On second, no I dont, keep booing those Habs I'd boo them too

Dude, you shouldn't expend so much energy hating Montreal; Save some for Ottawa as well!

 

[Johnny]

Dude, you shouldn't expend so much energy hating Montreal; Save some for Ottawa as well!

Dont worry, I can always find some hate inside me for Ottawa too, how could I possibly leave out Ottawa.

 

[High flyin' Habs*]

I dont know if it could get any worse then what SwisshokceyAcademy described, but, if so, I feel sorry for those Habs... On second, no I dont, keep booing those Habs I'd boo them too

Stop always posting the same thing...swisshockeyacademy that swisshockeyacademy this...blah blah blah. Montreal fans arent that bad, hey its not our fault if we're so passionate about our habs, better boo your team to let them know that they need to wake than to just sit their and do nothing like the Toronto fans.

 

[rulin]

Stop always posting the same thing...swisshockeyacademy that swisshockeyacademy this...blah blah blah. Montreal fans arent that bad, hey its not our fault if we're so passionate about our habs, better boo your team to let them know that they need to wake than to just sit their and do nothing like the Toronto fans.

I think it's all in good fun, so there's no need to get defensive.
Anyway, let the Leafs' fans have their fun ... it's not our fault they've resorted down to this.

 

[SwisshockeyAcademy]

Stop always posting the same thing...swisshockeyacademy that swisshockeyacademy this...blah blah blah. Montreal fans arent that bad, hey its not our fault if we're so passionate about our habs, better boo your team to let them know that they need to wake than to just sit their and do nothing like the Toronto fans.

I don't care what you do to the Habs, it is a disgrace to boo your National team off the ice in what was a great hockey game, Richter stealing the show. The littering of the ice was a carbon copy of the Czech fans after Germany trounced them. It would seem Bob macKenzie has set out to challenge the Toronto crowd and it may work.

 

[mcphee]

I don't care what you do to the Habs, it is a disgrace to boo your National team off the ice in what was a great hockey game, Richter stealing the show. The littering of the ice was a carbon copy of the Czech fans after Germany trounced them. It would seem Bob macKenzie has set out to challenge the Toronto crowd and it may work.

Was the fan reaction in Montreal that night not a protest of what they considered a high stick goal by Brett Hull ?

 

[Johnny]

Stop always posting the same thing...swisshockeyacademy that swisshockeyacademy this...blah blah blah. Montreal fans arent that bad, hey its not our fault if we're so passionate about our habs, better boo your team to let them know that they need to wake than to just sit their and do nothing like the Toronto fans.

What are you going on about, I support you 110 % when it comes to booing the Habs....Keep it up by all means, I'll be right there with you booing them Habs all the way for the rest of my life... To however turn so quickly on the National team was however as already mentioned a disgrace... Your so called "passion" does not justify acting like a bunch of assclowns. People who seem so eager to point out TO's supposed weakness as a hockey city and portray Montreal as this hockey city of perfection seem to have selective viewpoints... Montreal has it's negatives just as TO does. Montreal **** does in fact stink too, just as anyone else's **** does, as hard as that may be to believe for some of the Montreal palm palm wavers.

 

[High flyin' Habs*]

I don't care what you do to the Habs, it is a disgrace to boo your National team off the ice in what was a great hockey game, Richter stealing the show. The littering of the ice was a carbon copy of the Czech fans after Germany trounced them. It would seem Bob macKenzie has set out to challenge the Toronto crowd and it may work.

OK so it happend once 8 years, get over it!!

 

[monkey_00*]

Greetings and salutations from Hamilton Ontario Canada........

This little tourney was known before as the Canada Cup and the two times that my hometown of Hamilton Ontario hosted the tournament (1987 and 191) we were SO LOUD that fans were comparing the noise inside our Copps Coliseum to the atmosphere that they use to have inside the old Chicago Stadium.......we almost blew the roof off of the Arena.........

The games are not in Hamilton anymore they've been switched to Toronto which isn't exactly the best City in the world to host an International hockey tournament ESPECIALLY when you have the Toronto Maple Leafs pulling the strings in the background.........let me explain myself further just so you know what I'm getting at here........Toronto Maple Leafs (their real fans...the noisy ones) can't get tickets to Leafs games cause the Huge corporations and Banks centered in-and-around the Toronto area snap up their tickets faster than you can say "Go Leafs Go!".......these aren't real hockey fans these are the suit-and-tie people who go to these games because "it's the in-thing to do in Toronto"......just like it once use to be to go down to SkyDome and watch the Blue Jays play baseball......like that game against the Russians the other night, I couldn't help but notice that everytime the camera was on the Leafs bench all of those fans sitting right behind the Canadian bench were EXACTLY the same clowns that sit there behind the bench for the Leafs games including this BOZO that looks like a poor-man's Don Cherry with the white goatee..........In Hamilton we never had this problem.......the real hockey fans always had access to the game tickets and we made alot of noise at those 2-Canada Cups.....try getting some Bank CEO that earns a couple of million dollars a year to get off of his big fat A$$ AND MAKE NOSIE!.......I don't think so it's not going to work out that way........and THAT'S the problem with Toronto hosting a tourney like this.......the guys they have inside the ACC for these games are SNOBS and think they are too good to Cheer on Team Canada and make some noise............Too Bad......So Sad.

Cheers!~

monkey_00

 

[High flyin' Habs*]

What are you going on about, I support you 110 % when it comes to booing the Habs....Keep it up by all means, I'll be right there with you booing them Habs all the way for the rest of my life... To however turn so quickly on the National team was however as already mentioned a disgrace... Your so called "passion" does not justify acting like a bunch of assclowns. People who seem so eager to point out TO's supposed weakness as a hockey city and portray Montreal as this hockey city of perfection seem to have selective viewpoints... Montreal has it's negatives just as TO does. Montreal **** does in fact stink too, just as anyone else's **** does, as hard as that may be to believe for some of the Montreal palm palm wavers.

Yeah whatever you say bro! The Toronto crowd is boring compared to Montreal's!!
At least Montreal fans give a **** about their team.