Around the NHL Discussion Part XV

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BlueDream

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Aug 30, 2011
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The only thing I don't like about this deal from a Blues perspective is what it does to the free agent market for other players. Price of doing business just went up.
Meh, I don't see it like that. The UFA market is ALWAYS expensive. The prices were always going to be high. It's not like you were going to get players for a bargain and this signing all the sudden changed something. It's the same every year.

A bit conflicted, honestly.

Potentially having one less competitor for Tavares is nice, but a bullish UFA market might push more teams into the trade market, and that's probably not particularly good for the Blues at this point.
I don't see this as a big deal either. I personally expected Kane to re-sign there, given how her performed with them (and also given the cap space they had). I highly doubt many teams around the league are surprised by this. I'd wager it was probably expected.
 
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Itsnotatrap

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The last couple of years haven’t been that crazy as far as FA spends. I’m anticipating this year’s market may be a lot tougher, and this signing doesn’t change my mind on that at all.
 

The Note

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Kane has never hit 60 points, has only broken 50 twice, and has never played a full 82 game season. That contract is going to be ugly sooner rather than later (if it isn’t already.)
 
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MortiestOfMortys

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It’s so crazy to me that the Sharks have NO forwards signed past 2020, and then are gonna go out and drop 7x7 on Kane, which is even crazier. Their long-term core is now going to be a very old Burns and Vlasic, an oft-injured Kane, and Martin Jones who is legitimately stellar. Who knows, maybe they’re going the Vegas route
 

wannabebluesplayer

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Apr 16, 2012
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I'm kind of with @EastonBlues22 on this one. I'm conflicted as well. More teams in the trade market is bad for the Blues, but one less suitor for Tavares is a good thing, if it legitimately takes them out of the Tavares sweepstakes.
 

WeWentBlues

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After signing Kane the Sharks have 67.5M committed with 12.5M in space according to CapFriendly using their Armchair GM simulator.

RFAs are DeMelo coming off 650k, Hertl coming off 3M and Tierney coming off 735k.
UFAs - Thornton, Hansen, Fehr, Mashinter, Ward

After re-upping some of their players, I think they would have to make some room to sign Tavares.

It gets really interesting for San Jose after 2018-2019. Pavelski, Couture, Donskoi are all UFAs with a number of RFAs also due contracts.
 

MissouriMook

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After signing Kane the Sharks have 67.5M committed with 12.5M in space according to CapFriendly using their Armchair GM simulator.

RFAs are DeMelo coming off 650k, Hertl coming off 3M and Tierney coming off 735k.
UFAs - Thornton, Hansen, Fehr, Mashinter, Ward

After re-upping some of their players, I think they would have to make some room to sign Tavares.

It gets really interesting for San Jose after 2018-2019. Pavelski, Couture, Donskoi are all UFAs with a number of RFAs also due contracts.
They could save just over $3M next year by buying out Paul Martin, but Hertl will likely get $4M-5M and Tierney will certainly get $1.5M-$2M so that leaves them with $8.5M-$10M to work with. And none of this is accounting for Jumbo Joe if they bring him back.

I just don't see anyway they can sign Tavares without walking away from Jumbo Joe -AND- trading one of Couture, Pavelski, Burns or Vlasic.
 

WeWentBlues

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They could save just over $3M next year by buying out Paul Martin, but Hertl will likely get $4M-5M and Tierney will certainly get $1.5M-$2M so that leaves them with $8.5M-$10M to work with. And none of this is accounting for Jumbo Joe if they bring him back.

I just don't see anyway they can sign Tavares without walking away from Jumbo Joe -AND- trading one of Couture, Pavelski, Burns or Vlasic.
I agree they are going to have to do some maneuvering to sign Taveras.
 

TruBlu

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San Jose would have to move someone, but it wouldn't be like they would need to move a lot of cap, and they have a lot of contracts that would be easy to move. If anything, I think signing Kane means they might actually be looking to go after Tavares by showing him that they are bringing in talent.
 

EastonBlues22

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San Jose would have to move someone, but it wouldn't be like they would need to move a lot of cap, and they have a lot of contracts that would be easy to move. If anything, I think signing Kane means they might actually be looking to go after Tavares by showing him that they are bringing in talent.
Assuming the $7 million AAV is accurate, this leaves SJ with ~$65.89 million committed to 19 players next year, with Thornton, Hertl, Tierney, and DeMelo (and Tavares) still to sign. This is assuming that they let everyone else walk.

Thornton might take a very team friendly deal, but it's still hard to imagine him getting paid less than $5.5 million at the very minimum. Hertl will likely be making $5 million plus. Tierney should get $3.5 million or more, and let's say DeMelo gets $1.5 million. That alone takes them to $81.39 million.

Say they move their two biggest dump candidates in Martin and Boedker (combined $8.85 million), replacing one with a $900k guy. That takes the roster to 22 players and $73.44 million. You're still not cramming in Tavares if he wants $10 million plus (which he should absolutely get), even if the cap goes all the way up to $82 million. Who can they easily dump for cap space and replace cheaply after that?

They might be able to manage it somehow, but it sure doesn't look like it will be easy unless you make some pretty generous assumptions about what everyone else involved will end up being paid, or they do something shocking like walking away from Thornton. It may not be impossible, but I think this signing puts a pretty big dent in the likelihood that they sign Tavares, personally.
 

TruBlu

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Assuming the $7 million AAV is accurate, this leaves SJ with ~$65.89 million committed to 19 players next year, with Thornton, Hertl, Tierney, and DeMelo (and Tavares) still to sign. This is assuming that they let everyone else walk.

Thornton might take a very team friendly deal, but it's still hard to imagine him getting paid less than $5.5 million at the very minimum. Hertl will likely be making $5 million plus. Tierney should get $3.5 million or more, and let's say DeMelo gets $1.5 million. That alone takes them to $81.39 million.

Say they move their two biggest dump candidates in Martin and Boedker (combined $8.85 million), replacing one with a $900k guy. That takes the roster to 22 players and $73.44 million. You're still not cramming in Tavares if he wants $10 million plus (which he should absolutely get), even if the cap goes all the way up to $82 million. Who can they easily dump for cap space and replace cheaply after that?

They might be able to manage it somehow, but it sure doesn't look like it will be easy unless you make some pretty generous assumptions about what everyone else involved will end up being paid, or they do something shocking like walking away from Thornton. It may not be impossible, but I think this signing puts a pretty big dent in the likelihood that they sign Tavares, personally.
Most of the big money contracts they have left are at or near the end. Why do you think they'd be reluctant to move away from Thornton? He's 38, his production has dropped considerably the last couple of years, and he's coming off of a pretty major injury. He'd be the first person I looked at to make room for Tavares.
 

EastonBlues22

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Most of the big money contracts they have left are at or near the end. Why do you think they'd be reluctant to move away from Thornton? He's 38, his production has dropped considerably the last couple of years, and he's coming off of a pretty major injury. He'd be the first person I looked at to make room for Tavares.
SJ loves him. He's taken team friendly deals and has basically shunned playing anywhere else since he's been there. He's also arguably the leader in that locker room.

I think they want him around as long as he wants to be around. Certainly they're not looking to kick him to the curb. Maybe they make the tough call and move on from him if Tavares signs even though he wants to return, but I don't think it's particularly likely. I'd put the chances of Thornton wearing a Sharks uniform next season at 10x the chances of Tavares wearing it...maybe more.
 

Stopsight

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Oct 9, 2013
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Real happy to see Tampa in dire straits after dealing with their fans on here. If it holds out to be Washington vs Vegas i can be happy with either winner.
 

Celtic Note

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Looks like Ovechkin finally learned that you have to put in effort across all aspects of the game if you aspire to win. Hopefully Tarasenko doesn’t take so long to learn that lesson.
 

Captain Creampuff

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Sep 10, 2012
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Looks like Ovechkin finally learned that you have to put in effort across all aspects of the game if you aspire to win. Hopefully Tarasenko doesn’t take so long to learn that lesson.
Ovi certainly has had a great playoffs this year and has deserved to go all the way. Too bad the Knights are gonna ruin his dream in six :P
 
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Spektre

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TB played a horrific game 7. Down 3-0 going into the 3rd and refuse to shoot the puck. I thought I was watching the Blues for a stretch.
 

KirkOut

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TB played a horrific game 7. Down 3-0 going into the 3rd and refuse to shoot the puck. I thought I was watching the Blues for a stretch.
Once Gourde missed that wide open net during the TB onslaught when it was 1-0 I texted my Caps fan friend "Tampa will not score in this game". Us Blues fans have seen this kind of thing before. Unsurprisingly, after TB threw everything they had at Holtby, Burakovsky scored a whack goal on a broken down play and that let all the air out of the Lightning's tires. The 3rd period might as well have been a random regular season game. They were defeated before the 3rd even started.
 

simon IC

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A few observations from these playoffs:
Goaltending must be solid. Blues don't have this.
Grit still matters. Blues don't have this either.
Skating and endurance are a given. Getting better, but more work needs to be done by the Blues.
Puck battles and forechecking set teams apart. This is where I think the Blues need the most work!
Oh, excellent, excellent post! Thank you! The Blues need to take note of all four points!
 
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Bluesfan54

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One of these years I hope there's a team in the Final that I actually like. It's no fun watching when I dislike or just don't give a damn about both teams.
 
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