Around the NHL #14 - Offseason and junk

[InfinityIggy]

Continued from here.

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[Flames Fanatic]

To be fair @Dertell, Heatley was not even a shadow of what he used to be by the time he got to Boudreau. Stewart never looked the same after leaving Colorado.

 

[Lunatik]

To be fair @Dertell, Heatley was not even a shadow of what he used to be by the time he got to Boudreau. Stewart never looked the same after leaving Colorado.

Yeah those examples reek of desperately grasping at straws.

 

[Dertell]

To be fair @Dertell, Heatley was not even a shadow of what he used to be by the time he got to Boudreau. Stewart never looked the same after leaving Colorado.

The flipside of that argument goes to Staal and Perron. Especially Perron. They were both solid NHL player aside from one year with one team.

That's my point - it's not the coach, it's the players themselves being good or bad.

 

[Anglesmith]

Perron has pretty solid (his inconsistency everywhere aside) in every stop minus his last season with Pittsburgh. Boudreau hasn't done for Heatley, Stewart and... just about anyone else, really. Perron and Staal were both still solid players by most metrics.

I would argue that Stewart has actually been more effective the last two years under Boudreau than he was the previous one. He's winding down, though, as his body seems to have not held up to the strain he put on it in his early years. But Boudreau's system seems to allow slower but technically good players to thrive, like Getzlaf, Perron and Perry.

Regarding Iggy, I wouldn't drink the Avs fan KoolAid too much. Every fan base wants to blame the mercenaries at all costs when they're struggling as opposed to facing the reality of their core players not being good enough. You saw it with Iggy in Pittsburgh, where he was blamed for every big star on the team not showing up against Boston (while Iggy was played on his off-wing on the third line). You even saw it with Flames fans a bit this year when Gaudreau/Bennett were struggling and it was all Chiasson's fault. I would argue that Iggy brings as much to the Avs (for less) as Lucic does to the Oilers. Oilers fans are satisfied with Lucic, because his team puts him in a position to contribute and masks his deficiencies, whereas Avs fans want nothing to do with Iggy, because the team around him exacerbates his deficiencies. All Iggy needs is to be in a situation where his team can cover for his deficiencies and capitalize on the things he does well, like Lucic.

 

[Dertell]

We will agree to disagree on Stewart. To me he's invinsible most night in the worst ways while being bad defensively (not as bad as he used to be with Buffalo but that's more a buffalo having horrible systems with Nolan than anything else).

If anything, it's the other way around. Core players can absorb all the blame because no one will suggest we do anything about them; they just have to "get back on track". Small contract player are also a conveniant target because you can move them easily. You can say something similar about prospects. Mercenaries are different because you're stuck with them and they won't get any better. If they suck at the start, it's not likely they'll get any better. Basically, it's a denial thing. Mercenaries are more likely to be blamed while deserving it because they're often the result of purely reactionary moves with significant, negative consequences. Sure that's on the GM, but every GM is like that, really, and it doesn't change the problem the players themselves cause with their deals.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

It is the song that never ends. Yes it goes on and on my friends:

http://www.tsn.ca/coyotes-shocked-by-asu-s-arena-decision-1.664678

 

[Lunatik]

It is the song that never ends. Yes it goes on and on my friends:

http://www.tsn.ca/coyotes-shocked-by-asu-s-arena-decision-1.664678

It's looking more and more like a move is required. What are relocation options? If the current owners stay involved you would think Kansas City, Portland would be options. If they are looking to sell then Quebec City would be an option, as could Houston is the owner of the Rockets is interested in an NHL club (his agreement with the arena is no NHL can play there unless he owns it). Since the Markham arena project fell through I don't see becoming Toronto's second team as an option. Seattle could also be an option but only if an arena is approved.

 

[Volica]

It is the song that never ends. Yes it goes on and on my friends:

http://www.tsn.ca/coyotes-shocked-by-asu-s-arena-decision-1.664678

Please, just send them to Quebec and be done with it.
You have a city that really needs something to give them a bump in happiness right now. It's about 800k people in the greater area, that can support an NHL franchise. The Yotes are a joke, with a joke ownership group.

They've produced Matthews and Tkachuk. That's enough to hang a hat on; now let's move'em up to Quebec

 

[Flames Fanatic]

While it may be easy to say move em to Quebec, the Islanders currently have no home and Carolina's owner is looking to sell the franchise. So yeah. Lots of problems lately it seems.

 

[Lunatik]

While it may be easy to say move em to Quebec, the Islanders currently have no home and Carolina's owner is looking to sell the franchise. So yeah. Lots of problems lately it seems.

The Islanders and Mets are looking at building an arena in Queens, so I am not as worried about them. But the 'Canes are a definite concern. I wonder when we start hearing Hamilton or London/Waterloo again.

 

[Volica]

While it may be easy to say move em to Quebec, the Islanders currently have no home and Carolina's owner is looking to sell the franchise. So yeah. Lots of problems lately it seems.

It turns out, as crazy as it might sound, that hockey just doesn't work in some markets.
Hartford is looking for a team, Quebec is looking for a team; and Seattle will likely be in running for one in the next 5 years or so.

IF the NHL got rid of like 5 teams, tomorrow, I don't think there'd be many tears shed.
Carolina, Florida and Arizona (also the Isles, I just hate lumping them in there with that rich history) have a hard time even get the arena near full.

 

[Mobiandi]

The Islanders and Mets are looking at building an arena in Queens, so I am not as worried about them. But the 'Canes are a definite concern. I wonder when we start hearing Hamilton or London/Waterloo again.

I hope not. The NHL does not need another Ontario team

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

The Islanders and Mets are looking at building an arena in Queens, so I am not as worried about them. But the 'Canes are a definite concern. I wonder when we start hearing Hamilton or London/Waterloo again.

Hamilton would be the realistic of the 3 options. Kitchener - Cambridge - Waterloo and London have under 500k including the Metro of both.

Hamilton is over 700k. I think Quebec City has a better chance.

 

[Lunatik]

Hamilton would be the realistic of the 3 options. Kitchener - Cambridge - Waterloo and London have under 500k including the Metro of both.

Hamilton is over 700k. I think Quebec City has a better chance.

I meant Kitchener/Waterloo, my bad. But I recall hearing the greater area. The 2011 census had that region at 477k, but 2013 estimates for the region were 559k (I assume this is a larger area than the census area) with expectation of 10k per year growth. With that region being rich in terms of corporate ventures, I would think they would actually be better off than a team like Winnipeg despite having 200k less people. Build a 15k seat arena with plenty of luxury boxes and they will be set I think

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

I meant Kitchener/Waterloo, my bad. But I recall hearing the greater area. The 2011 census had that region at 477k, but 2013 estimates for the region were 559k (I assume this is a larger area than the census area) with expectation of 10k per year growth. With that region being rich in terms of corporate ventures, I would think they would actually be better off than a team like Winnipeg despite having 200k less people. Build a 15k seat arena with plenty of luxury boxes and they will be set I think

Yeah that's fair. I didn't take into account of the 5 year growth since lol,

we will find out since the census for 2016 comes out on February 8th.

 

[Lunatik]

Yeah that's fair. I didn't take into account of the 5 year growth since lol,

we will find out since the census for 2016 comes out on February 8th.

My guess is that it is close to the 559k, but the region will claim more as it will consider itself larger than the census region.

 

[Unlimited Chequing]

I wonder when we start hearing Hamilton or London/Waterloo again.

It's funny, I was just thinking the other day about that whole debacle with that Blackberry owner guy and how if he had managed to buy a hockey team that it might have been more financially successful than Blackberry right now

 

[MonyontheMoney]

Dallas, Nashville, St.Louis, Winnipeg, and Anaheim (OT) lost tonight. Minnesota is beating Vancouver. Would be nice if L.A would have lost, but I'll gladly take the first 4 teams (and possibly Vancouver) losing in regulation any day.

 

[Bounces R Way]

Quebec City will not have another NHL team. Place is full of old francophones that have cheered for the Habs for as long as they can remember. Basically Gary's nightmare.

Seattle is an awesome city, and a pretty decent sports town if the organization is run properly. There or Houston makes the most sense.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Quebec City will not have another NHL team. Place is full of old francophones that have cheered for the Habs for as long as they can remember. Basically Gary's nightmare.

Seattle is an awesome city, and a pretty decent town if the organization is run properly. There or Houston makes the most sense.

Seattle is not an awesome city, it's a horrible city culturally. Houston makes zero sense. Quebec City or bust. We could put one in Milwaukee as well.

 

[MonyontheMoney]

At some point Bettman has to realize even a smaller Canadian market is likely to be more successful than trying to beat a dead horse in southern American cities that haven't worked for ~10 years. Doesn't he?

 

[Flames Fanatic]

Well minus the Kings winning last night it was a pretty good night for our playoff chances.

 

[Lunatik]

it's cute people think that it is up to Bettman who gets an expansion team

 

[MonyontheMoney]

it's cute people think that it is up to Bettman who gets an expansion team

See NHL's rejection of Quebecors' expansion bid. It's not like Bettman absolute authority, but he also does have a large part in it.

Regardless, I wasn't talking expansion, but rather relocation of a team like Arizona, which again he absolutely does control to some extent.