Value of: #9 plus (NYR) for #5 (ARZ)

[One Winged Angel]

Then you won't move up.
It makes no sense for the other team to drop 4 spots from the top of the draft unless NYR includes #28.

In your opinion, sure.

 

[One Winged Angel]

26OA + 28OA + Namestnikov FOR 5OA

2 firsts and Vlad? To move 4 spots in a crapshoot draft class??? Yikes.

 

[Brock Radunske]

In your opinion, sure.

Ok, fair.
What would make it happen in your opinion?

 

[rt]

Don’t think Rangers should pay the price but let’s say your theory is true about the scouts having their eye on top D man outside of Dahlin...

Arizona gets Zuccarello, 9oa, 70oa

Rangers get 5oa, Max Domi, 55oa

I feel the Rangers can get a better payment of Zucc but interested in the value

Would not trade Domi for Zuccarello
Would not trade 5oa for 9oa
Would not trade 55oa for 70oa

 

[rt]

2 firsts and Vlad? To move 4 spots in a crapshoot draft class??? Yikes.

He didn’t include the 9th overall. He’s suggesting you keep both. Which is just as crazy as what you thought he suggested.

 

[One Winged Angel]

Ok, fair.
What would make it happen in your opinion?

That's just the thing. It's my opinion. It doesn't mean much. None of us know what would make it fair.

I think a second and someone like Spooner or Namestnikov would be fair. I know I'll have detractors and that's fine.

I just don't think a 1st rounder to move 4 spots is plausible, when others have echoed my sentiment, stating that the difference in quality of player between 5 and 9 is minimal, if any at all.

This draft although said to be "deep" is a crapshoot because after 2, a lot of the pieces become interchangeable. I think we will see someone drafted completely off the board in the top-10 because this will be a year where after the drop off from 1 & 2 to the rest of the class, you won't see another significant drop off until maybe the next round.

Therefore, I don't see a reason to deal a first rounder to move up 4 spots, which really isn't a lot to begin with. You can disagree if you'd like, that's your opinion, just as I have voiced mine in this post. I respect that.

 

[One Winged Angel]

He didn’t include the 9th overall. He’s suggesting you keep both. Which is just as crazy as what you thought he suggested.

You're right, I misread it.

I wouldn't even do those 2 picks and Namestnikov for the 5th. I'd rather hold on to the picks and take someone like Merkley late.

 

[rt]

You're right, I misread it.

I wouldn't even do those 2 picks and Namestnikov for the 5th. I'd rather hold on to the picks and take someone like Merkley late.

You’re saying that you prefer picks 26 and 28 and Namestnikov to pick 5? Cmon...

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Namestnikov or Spooner or Vesey take it or leave it.

 

[Alluckks]

9 + 28 + Namestnikov for 5 + Crouse

Or just 9 + 28 for 5

Rangers would be moving up for Wahlstrom most likely though

 

[lanceuppercut75]

Rangers would be moving up for Wahlstrom most likely though

Coyotes would be moving down for Wahlstrom though, therefore no deal.

UNLESS Rangers scouts are high on a D even moreso than Wahlstrom. Thus, this thread.

 

[Alluckks]

Coyotes would be moving down for Wahlstrom though, therefore no deal.

UNLESS Rangers scouts are high on a D even moreso than Wahlstrom. Thus, this thread.

I saw what you wrote, but Wahlstrom is someone that they would be moving up for lol and the Arizona FO wouldn't make a trade conditional on who the Rangers are drafting at 5

It was an ask for value thread, I think you got the answer

9 + 28

 

[bernmeister]

Are you aware that Arizona doesn’t have their original 2nd? They have a late second that is 55oa

thank you!
I didn't check that detail that closely.
so in lieu of a better 2nd it would be 55OA + reasonable add

 

[bernmeister]

We brought in immediate help last year by trading the 7th OA for starting goaltender and a 2C. Our biggest holes on the roster are a true first pairing RD and a 1C, and we aren't going to land either of those without giving up an exorbitant amount of young talent and the 5th OA. I'm sure OEL was well aware of this during negotiations and indicated his willingness to resign anyway to a team-friendly deal.

There are ways to find immediate help for our young core without giving up a top five pick.

26OA + 28OA + Namestnikov FOR 5OA

If you give us 5OA while allowing us to retain 9OA, the young and useful assets returned could be increased.

We do not have true 1RD to offer, Shattenkirk stays for misc reasons.
High end 1C not available, Zib is closest and he stays unless a package for 2OA is involved.

But Pionk, an actual RD, who the rest of the base certainly does not wanna move, I consider him at the right deal in a 1 step backward 2 step forward context.
And Namest. can 2C as a stop gap, Stepan til you get a better top pivot [Stastny?] w/Namest then flipping to W.

26OA + Pionk + Namest.
for
5OA + RD prospect Wood

the vets are 22 and 25, respectively, w/Pionk being waivers exempt

thoughts?

 

[TGWL]

You're right, I misread it.

I wouldn't even do those 2 picks and Namestnikov for the 5th. I'd rather hold on to the picks and take someone like Merkley late.

Why take Merkley late when you can take somebody like Hughes early? Coming out of the draft with the #5, and #9 is much better than #9, #26, and #28. I'd easily do that - but no team would accept that. 2 late first and a player going nowhere with us for a 5th? Sign me up. Absolutely! We really lose out on 1 draft pick here, but we replace that with a top 5. I just can't see any GM in the NHL feeling the same way.

 

[Heldig]

Arizona needs to get better right away. The player they draft at 5 may be able to step in next season. Trading high picks for more futures makes little sense for the Coyotes.

 

[bernmeister]

Arizona needs to get better right away. The player they draft at 5 may be able to step in next season. Trading high picks for more futures makes little sense for the Coyotes.

Possible, but not as much of a given as you suggest.

I would say best scenario is 9 game cup o coffee towards end of season. If he is ready enough and pivotal to playoffs, you consider to burn an elc year. More likely, that year not burned, he is eased into full time following season.

Everyone is different, of course, but consider Draisatil as an example.
3OA, should be more ready than 5OA.
First year he was up, he had issues. Even with all the prep time from the draft til season started. Think he may have even been sent down briefly.
Fortunately for Oil, they were patient and he turned it around soon enough.

But day 1 as a rookie is usually pushing it too much.

 

[Heldig]

@bernmeister I did say "may" be able to help this year. By no means is it a given. However, the player chosen at 5 his much closer to the NHL than ones chosen at 28th. The Coyotes need immediate help.

 

[One Winged Angel]

You’re saying that you prefer picks 26 and 28 and Namestnikov to pick 5? Cmon...

I prefer not to give up 2 1st round picks and a top-6 forward for the team right now for a player at 5 who isn't going to be that much better than the player we're getting at 9.

The Rangers should be holding onto their picks unless it's a cant miss deal. Trading multiple upper-end assets for the 5th overall pick this year isn't a no-brainer to me.

If this draft class wasn't a crapshoot, I'd consider doing that. Would Arizona at that point? I would assume not, but as it stands, this deal doesn't make sense for the Rangers right now.

 

[One Winged Angel]

Why take Merkley late when you can take somebody like Hughes early? Coming out of the draft with the #5, and #9 is much better than #9, #26, and #28. I'd easily do that - but no team would accept that. 2 late first and a player going nowhere with us for a 5th? Sign me up. Absolutely! We really lose out on 1 draft pick here, but we replace that with a top 5. I just can't see any GM in the NHL feeling the same way.

I love Hughes, I'm super high on him. To me, he and Merkley project as similar players. My thing is, if I can take Wahlstrom at 9 and Merkley and Sandin later, having more pieces is better for the team's outlook and future. Believe it or not, they need help everywhere outside of center and even then, I'd still love to have a franchise type. So if they can keep more picks and take swings at homerun type talent at the end of the first, I'm all about that.

If they pulled off the move, would I be disappointed? No, I just prefer them keeping more picks, considering they don't have Tampa's 1st next year... yet. To be honest, if they had that 2nd 1st rounder next year already, I'd probably be more for making a trade, but I'm not fond of moving picks now to move up with this year's class. If the top 10 was better overall, I'd be for it. I just think with this class, you're going to see a lot of picks that are going to shock people because of how wide open this year is.

 

[bernmeister]

@bernmeister I did say "may" be able to help this year. By no means is it a given. However, the player chosen at 5 his much closer to the NHL than ones chosen at 28th. The Coyotes need immediate help.

perhaps I didn't phrase that well.

no contradicting the bold
but in my latest offer at 39, which was:
26OA + Pionk + Namest.
for
5OA + RD prospect Wood

you can see there are 2 immediate impact pieces made available.

Of course the issue is the quantity and quality of what NY is giving up in lieu of 9.

 

[bernmeister]

perhaps I didn't phrase that well.

no contradicting the bold
but in my latest offer at 39, which was:
26OA + Pionk + Namest.
for
5OA + RD prospect Wood

you can see there are 2 immediate impact pieces made available.

Of course the issue is the quantity and quality of what NY is giving up in lieu of 9.

See ducky liked this post.
Deal then?
head count, pls esp NY and AZ fans

 

[Shootertooter]

I just hope the Rangers don't go off the board like they did with last years 7OA.
I'd be happy with Wahlstrom early and Sandin and Merkley later.

 

[rt]

Namestnikov or Spooner or Vesey take it or leave it.

Oh what a hard decision. Haha. Ummm...leave it.

 

[rt]

Or just 9 + 28 for 5

There you go. That’s sensible.