2024 NHL Draft: Play Like a Sieve So We Can Draft Zeev

Sysreq

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Apr 9, 2015
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This is some next-level coping.

Maybe. Can you honestly say you haven’t enjoyed this year more than the last few though? I know I have. I was watching the Chicago game and sweating bullets when we were ahead. Every shot I wince thinking it will go into the net. Every PK I watch intently hoping for a defensive break down.

There is actual reason for me to watch again. Wanting to lose is no different than wanting to win. At least I feel something while watching the games again.
 

Hodge

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Apr 27, 2021
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I know a lot of people will be disappointed if we don’t get 1OA, but regardless of what happens, this has been the first season since 18-19 that I’ve actually been invested in the team. Playing to lose is really just playing to win backwards. It sounds crazy but I feel like the games matter again. If we have to do this for another few seasons, I am honestly okay with that. This is way better than the end of the DW era. There is hope at least. We are building to something better. We keep putting in the work and it will come with time. Regardless of the draft lottery I am happier now than before. I just hope wish they hadn’t wasted so much time before accepting reality.
Couldn't agree more. It was really the 2019-22 seasons that were an unending slog to get through, knowing there was absolutely no reason to be invested in any of it. No chance of making the playoffs, no chance of a top pick, no young players to look forward to. Now at least there's a light at the end of the tunnel even if we have no way of knowing just how far off it is.
 

TheBeard

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Maybe. Can you honestly say you haven’t enjoyed this year more than the last few though? I know I have. I was watching the Chicago game and sweating bullets when we were ahead. Every shot I wince thinking it will go into the net. Every PK I watch intently hoping for a defensive break down.

There is actual reason for me to watch again. Wanting to lose is no different than wanting to win. At least I feel something while watching the games again.
No, I haven't. I get the mindset where there's hope down the line, but that's not making watching the team this year any easier. It's not like any of these players with the exception of a couple are going to be part of the team's future. I see the sadistic enjoyment of losing, but watching a game, seeing 82 people in the stands as the team loses by 6 goals isn't my idea of enjoyment. It's like saying, " I'm enjoying eating this lettuce because it'll be good for my health in the long run."
 

Hodge

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Apr 27, 2021
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No, I haven't. I get the mindset where there's hope down the line, but that's not making watching the team this year any easier. It's not like any of these players with the exception of a couple are going to be part of the team's future. I see the sadistic enjoyment of losing, but watching a game, seeing 82 people in the stands as the team loses by 6 goals isn't my idea of enjoyment.
No offense but maybe that means you should check out for a few years until the team is good again. It won't make you any less of a fan.
 

dmcccdmn

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Dec 10, 2005
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Fantilli and Carlsson weren't available at the time of our pick We literally couldn't draft them...how is that a failure? Smith has done everything we asked.

Michkov looks great, but I'm very happy with Smith all things considered. I mean we could draft Demidov this year who would be our version of Michkov without the picking certain teams rumours and 1 less year in the KHL.

I was referring to Grier's failure in not making trades at the trade deadline to ensure that last year's tank would have succeeded. Just 1 less win and we would have had a choice between Bedard, Fantilli or Carlsson, no worse than 3rd overall pick. Fantilli and Carlsson were gone by the time we got to pick because Grier didn't do his job. Will Smith did everything he could so I'm happy with our 4th pick. But would you rather have Fantilli/Carlsson than Smith?
 

Sysreq

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Apr 9, 2015
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I was referring to Grier's failure in not making trades at the trade deadline to ensure that last year's tank would have succeeded. Just 1 less win and we would have had a choice between Bedard, Fantilli or Carlsson, no worse than 3rd overall pick. Fantilli and Carlsson were gone by the time we got to pick because Grier didn't do his job. Will Smith did everything he could so I'm happy with our 4th pick. But would you rather have Fantilli/Carlsson than Smith?

Ehh. You draft what you draft though. Smith is 6 months younger and just put up a better Freshman season than Fantilli did the year before. Not to mention his better WJC-20 performance. There's the famous parable where no matter what happens an old man says "we'll see". Smith was a good pick, let's not kill ourselves with what-if scenarios. What if we had won 1OA instead? I think GMMG has played his hand as it develops well enough. I am happy enough with what we have gotten that I don't really worry about what else might have been out there. We're doing enough.
 

Alaskanice

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Ehh. You draft what you draft though. Smith is 6 months younger and just put up a better Freshman season than Fantilli did the year before. Not to mention his better WJC-20 performance. There's the famous parable where no matter what happens an old man says "we'll see". Smith was a good pick, let's not kill ourselves with what-if scenarios. What if we had won 1OA instead? I think GMMG has played his hand as it develops well enough. I am happy enough with what we have gotten that I don't really worry about what else might have been out there. We're doing enough.
Couldn’t have said this better. I love Will Smith on team teal.
 

dmcccdmn

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Dec 10, 2005
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Nah. I'm still standing by this team. I don't have a "Serious Stanley cup contenders or bust" mentality. I just want them to be competitive.

You share Doug Wilson's mentality. That winning the Stanley Cup isn't the only goal. Winning some games, being competitive to get fans excited and attending games year after year is acceptable.

I'm of the crowd that believe in having the worst record possible to add high-end picks to rebuild the franchise. That being a playoff team isn't enough. The ultimate goal is the Cup. To get from where we are right now to being a serious Cup contenders, we would need a lot of young talents. I would be perfectly happy if we have 0-82 record the next few years to have top-3 picks every year. But everyone is different and that's why you see people cheering when they dropped from being worst team to 4th worst team last year. People actually cheered seeing that.
 
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dmcccdmn

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Ehh. You draft what you draft though. Smith is 6 months younger and just put up a better Freshman season than Fantilli did the year before. Not to mention his better WJC-20 performance. There's the famous parable where no matter what happens an old man says "we'll see". Smith was a good pick, let's not kill ourselves with what-if scenarios. What if we had won 1OA instead? I think GMMG has played his hand as it develops well enough. I am happy enough with what we have gotten that I don't really worry about what else might have been out there. We're doing enough.

I am glad we picked him. I really do hope that Will Smith will one day become better than Fantilli and/or Carlsson. He has been quite a surprise and I hope he'll continue to surprise us.

I have always been fascinated with how prospects pan out in redraft a few years removed from their draft. Pundits get things wrong all the time so we'll see.
 

STL Shark

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No offense but maybe that means you should check out for a few years until the team is good again. It won't make you any less of a fan.
That has been me. I am not going to stay up for 9:30 PM local puck drops for a team that is rebuilding. I watch the 10 minute condensed game, check the box score, and read the game threads basically everyday so I can have an informed take on the team, but I am not going to lose literal sleep for this squad right now like I did when things were good on the ice.

I will watch next year for sure when the likes of Smith, Celebrini (speak it into existence), and Muk are playing meaningful roles, but not this year.
 

weastern bias

worst team in the league
Feb 3, 2012
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Lol, Seravalli is definitely not mad that he got the Labanc scoop wrong or anything like that

He's been trying to denigrate the Grier administration ever since by blaming him for the sins of Doug Wilson while also double-talking the returns he got on his tear-down trades all the way
 

TheBeard

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You share Doug Wilson's mentality. That winning the Stanley Cup isn't the only goal. Winning some games, being competitive to get fans excited and attending games year after year is acceptable.

I'm of the crowd that believe in having the worst record possible to add high-end picks to rebuild the franchise. That being a playoff team isn't enough. The ultimate goal is the Cup. To get from where we are right now to being a serious Cup contenders, we would need a lot of young talents. I would be perfectly happy if we have 0-82 record the next few years to have top-3 picks every year. But everyone is different and that's why you see people cheering when they dropped from being worst team to 4th worst team last year. People actually cheered seeing that.
You’re incorrect in that assessment. Doug had a win at all cost mentality (even though as we’re seeing in comparison to what Vegas does he actually did not). He wanted to sacrifice younger pieces and picks for immediate gratification. I, on the other hand want to see a competitive team, which, at this point there’s no excuse for that not to happen unless Grier purposely wants to tank again. There’s absolutely no reason to purposely tank beyond this year. The team doesn’t have a lot of talent on the club right now and the youth will experience some growing pains, so the team will still struggle, but I doubt they’re losing back to back ten goal games like this year. I doubt they’re blowing a 4 goal lead against the second worst team In hockey. Again, for that to happen Grier has to actively go out there and do everything in his power not to improve this team.

Comparing my mindset of wanting to see the team I root for play decent hockey versus a man trying to hold onto his job is just a dick thing to say. Want to go that route? Frankly, I find it pretty f***ing pathetic then to root against your team until they’re good again. That’s the definition of a bandwagon fan IMO. “Looool share in the joke of the franchise with everyone because I don’t even care about them if they suck!"
 

Jargon

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I’m somewhere in the middle. I watch far fewer games than I used to but still try to catch them when they’re on. I watch mostly for our prospects development and, especially in the latter months, have been sort of enjoying cheering for the tank.

That said, I’m with @TheBeard about next year - I’d like to see a team that’s full of prospects and competing, even if they’re still bottom 5, I don’t want to see a historically awful team again.
 

TheBeard

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I’m somewhere in the middle. I watch far fewer games than I used to but still try to catch them when they’re on. I watch mostly for our prospects development and, especially in the latter months, have been sort of enjoying cheering for the tank.

That said, I’m with @TheBeard about next year - I’d like to see a team that’s full of prospects and competing, even if they’re still bottom 5, I don’t want to see a historically awful team again.
Like I said, I’m not asking for major moves, but if he’s purposely stunting the development of nhl-ready prospects because he wants to add to the prospect pool for 2028 then it’s a slap in the face of anyone still financially supporting this team.
 

weastern bias

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We don't have the amount of high level prospects to be able to pull away from the bottom of the league by injecting youth just yet

I want to run the Toronto model of a rebuild, they had a handful of high end draft picks graduate together to support one another and lighten the burden off each other's shoulders so they weren't crushing their young players with undue expectations (they also traded for a legitimate starting goaltender)

In my mind the ideal scenario is that we bottom our for one more season, Smith, our 2024 1st and our 2025 1st (possibly also Pittsburgh's 2025 1st if everything works in our favor) can all graduate together and none of them are tasked with saving the franchise by themselves, they instead can work as a team along with all the support we can offer with tens of millions in capspace

A wrench gets thrown in if we win the lottery, Celebrini will be too good to go back to college, but that's a happy note because his presence would accelerate the rebuild anyway, but unless we win 1st overall this year my plan would be to hold the kids back and tank one more year

We're at the bottom of it all right now, it's still going to be quite a while before we're legitimately good, I don't expect to be competitive any time soon
 

Jargon

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We don't have the amount of high level prospects to be able to pull away from the bottom of the league by injecting youth just yet

I want to run the Toronto model of a rebuild, they had a handful of high end draft picks graduate together to support one another and lighten the burden off each other's shoulders so they weren't crushing their young players with undue expectations (they also traded for a legitimate starting goaltender)

In my mind the ideal scenario is that we bottom our for one more season, Smith, our 2024 1st and our 2025 1st (possibly also Pittsburgh's 2025 1st if everything works in our favor) can all graduate together and none of them are tasked with saving the franchise by themselves, they instead can work as a team along with all the support we can offer with tens of millions in capspace

A wrench gets thrown in if we win the lottery, Celebrini will be too good to go back to college, but that's a happy note because his presence would accelerate the rebuild anyway, but unless we win 1st overall this year my plan would be to hold the kids back and tank one more year

We're at the bottom of it all right now, it's still going to be quite a while before we're legitimately good, I don't expect to be competitive any time soon

I had a similar thought that I wonder if what Grier does with Smith is dependent on whether we win Celebrini. If we get him, I can see Smith turning pro, Musty possibly getting the Carlson treatment, etc etc, essentially yeah, speeding things up.

I hope, for the sake of my own enjoyment, that happens.
 

Cas

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We might try to speed things up, but I can't see Celebrini being better than a decent 3C/mediocre 2C in year one, and that's my optimistic prediction. Smith and Musty, etc, will likely fall in below that in performance in 24-25. That won't move the needle much at all.
 

dmcccdmn

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Dec 10, 2005
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You’re incorrect in that assessment. Doug had a win at all cost mentality (even though as we’re seeing in comparison to what Vegas does he actually did not). He wanted to sacrifice younger pieces and picks for immediate gratification. I, on the other hand want to see a competitive team, which, at this point there’s no excuse for that not to happen unless Grier purposely wants to tank again. There’s absolutely no reason to purposely tank beyond this year. The team doesn’t have a lot of talent on the club right now and the youth will experience some growing pains, so the team will still struggle, but I doubt they’re losing back to back ten goal games like this year. I doubt they’re blowing a 4 goal lead against the second worst team In hockey. Again, for that to happen Grier has to actively go out there and do everything in his power not to improve this team.

Comparing my mindset of wanting to see the team I root for play decent hockey versus a man trying to hold onto his job is just a dick thing to say. Want to go that route? Frankly, I find it pretty f***ing pathetic then to root against your team until they’re good again. That’s the definition of a bandwagon fan IMO. “Looool share in the joke of the franchise with everyone because I don’t even care about them if they suck!"

I guess that's why I said everyone is different. I can't wrap my head around this line of thinking. To others it probably makes perfect sense. I'm just glad that I'm able to endure this rebuild better than most.

To me, If you ask me to choose between a top-3 prospect vs a top-10, top-15 prospect + a handful more wins in a meaningless season, I would pick a top-3 prospect without hesitation.

Watching us loading up on high-end prospects and watching them grow is what's making this rebuild actually more fun than the last few years.
 

SjMilhouse

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Jul 18, 2012
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What's the rush? Let prospects develop how they need to develop (juniors, college, AHL, whatever). It's not like throwing Musty or Smith into the NHL is going to do much for the team in the next year or two. I'm not expecting anyone to be REAL impact players until they are 24/25 anyways.
 

dmcccdmn

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Dec 10, 2005
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What's the rush? Let prospects develop how they need to develop (juniors, college, AHL, whatever). It's not like throwing Musty or Smith into the NHL is going to do much for the team in the next year or two. I'm not expecting anyone to be REAL impact players until they are 24/25 anyways.

Some prospects' development are stunted when rushed to the NHL too soon before they're ready. We've all seen this. Musty, Smith and even Celebrini could all use time to develop before joining the NHL. They are growing perfectly fine where they are. Having them join the Sharsk would certainly make watching the Sharks more enjoyable and sell more tickets but to the detrimental of their development.
 

Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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We might try to speed things up, but I can't see Celebrini being better than a decent 3C/mediocre 2C in year one, and that's my optimistic prediction. Smith and Musty, etc, will likely fall in below that in performance in 24-25. That won't move the needle much at all.
He doesn't need to be anything specifically in his rookie year. He just needs to get the experience. My ideal scenario is landing Celebrini and going out and signing Stamkos to put on his wing. There's a lot to do on the blue line that if they don't get super aggressive there is going to hold back a lot of the younger forwards to a degree but it's not going to all happen in one offseason.

Some prospects' development are stunted when rushed to the NHL too soon before they're ready. We've all seen this. Musty, Smith and even Celebrini could all use time to develop before joining the NHL. They are growing perfectly fine where they are. Having them join the Sharsk would certainly make watching the Sharks more enjoyable and sell more tickets but to the detrimental of their development.
Some, sure. I don't know if those three will be those guys and I think it's better for them to get some pro experience sooner rather than later. Guys that are blowing away their competition at lower levels need to be challenged.
 
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TheBeard

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I guess that's why I said everyone is different. I can't wrap my head around this line of thinking. To others it probably makes perfect sense. I'm just glad that I'm able to endure this rebuild better than most.

To me, If you ask me to choose between a top-3 prospect vs a top-10, top-15 prospect + a handful more wins in a meaningless season, I would pick a top-3 prospect without hesitation.

Watching us loading up on high-end prospects and watching them grow is what's making this rebuild actually more fun than the last few years.
I think you’re struggling to separate competing on the ice and competing in the standings. I doubt this team is anything but a bottom feeder next year but with this haul and then next year’s two picks I’d rather enjoy the season by 10-15% and pick 6-8th than lose another entire season of watching so we can all spend our time discussing the merits of the worst case from dropping in the lotto to 3.
 
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gaucholoco3

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Jun 22, 2015
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A wrench gets thrown in if we win the lottery, Celebrini will be too good to go back to college, but that's a happy note because his presence would accelerate the rebuild anyway, but unless we win 1st overall this year my plan would be to hold the kids back and tank one more year
If Celebrini is too good for NCAA then so is Smith.

Both will be in the NHL next year.
 

Jargon

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Apr 12, 2011
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Some prospects' development are stunted when rushed to the NHL too soon before they're ready. We've all seen this. Musty, Smith and even Celebrini could all use time to develop before joining the NHL. They are growing perfectly fine where they are. Having them join the Sharsk would certainly make watching the Sharks more enjoyable and sell more tickets but to the detrimental of their development.

Musty is obliterating the OHL, Celebrini and Smith are dominating their league — Smith more than Celebrini (though he’s got a better team and is older.

I think them going pro helps their development, it doesn’t necessarily stunt it. That said, it would have to mean signing a few more vets to help them through it. Granlund is great. Sturm is great. We need like 3-4 more guys like them who can shelter the kids a bit. Maybe Couture actually recovers…
 

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