Speculation: 2018 Root for the Tank Thread

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Rasmus CacOlainen

The end of the Tank
Sep 24, 2015
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Even with last nights loss Im still notnconfident at all we can secure last and even second from bottom place as we still have 5 games left versus non-playoff contenders.
Arizona have just 4 (and that includes Calgary).
Vancouver also have only 4.

The game versus Arizona is an absolute must lose to try to at least nail down second from bottom a bit as I dont think anyone outtanks Vancouver at this point.
 

UnleashRasmus

Rasmus has gone Super Saiyan VI!
Apr 15, 2012
6,473
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Regardless of where we drop there will be a good to great asset added. Whether it's in the back where it's truly a make or break draft. Even into the second round there are guys that I'd take in a heartbeat. As well as the talented European crop. This is a draft that Botterill needs to sweep up at.
 

La Cosa Nostra

Caporegime
Jun 25, 2009
14,073
2,335
The last ten games are huge. Depending on if we finish 31st,30th or 29th is very important. It's going to decide if we get to pick 4th,5th or 6th after another shit season where teams ahead and Behind us will win a top 3 pick and we will probably get pick 5.
 

EichHart

Registered User
Jul 3, 2011
14,380
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There is no way the Canucks don't finish last, they are the worst team I've seen this year by far. I think it goes 31st- Canucks, 30th- Buffalo 29th Arizona. It's a 3 team race.
 

EichHart

Registered User
Jul 3, 2011
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Hamburg, NY
I don't want the 2nd or 3rd pick.

We need the lottery balls to bring us a Defensemen.... either win the lottery for Dahlin, or get leap frogged in the lottery and land in the #4/5 spot for one of the next tier of Defensemen.

What are your top 5 d prospects looking like? Haven't had a chance to watch any of them this year.
 

AustonsNostrils

Registered User
Apr 5, 2016
7,409
2,533
What are your top 5 d prospects looking like? Haven't had a chance to watch any of them this year.

there are 4 in a tier after Dahlin - Adam Boqvist of Brynas SHL, Evan Bouchard of the London Knights, Quinn Hughes of the University of Michigan, Noah Dobson of Acadie Bathurst of the QJMHL

there is no strong consensus in the ranking of them, probably will remain that way until the draft.
 

N.Y. Orangeman

Registered User
Mar 15, 2002
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I don't want the 2nd or 3rd pick.

We need the lottery balls to bring us a Defensemen.... either win the lottery for Dahlin, or get leap frogged in the lottery and land in the #4/5 spot for one of the next tier of Defensemen.

This....a thousand times, this.
 

Team Cozens

Registered User
Oct 24, 2013
6,566
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Burlington
I don't want the 2nd or 3rd pick.

We need the lottery balls to bring us a Defensemen.... either win the lottery for Dahlin, or get leap frogged in the lottery and land in the #4/5 spot for one of the next tier of Defensemen.

If not #1 then next best case scenario is to trade back from #2 to #4/5 to add another high pick in the draft. I will take any lottery win and deal from a position of strength.
 

1972

"Craigs on it"
Apr 9, 2012
14,426
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Canada
Anyone that says "I dont want Number 2 or 3 pick, give me Number 4 or 5 pick instead cause it's better for me" needs to go visit a doctor.

I agree, i don't care what the quality of players even is. The second or third overall pick is a significantly more valuable asset then the 5th or 6th pick.
 

Jame

Registered User
Sep 4, 2002
52,673
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What are your top 5 d prospects looking like? Haven't had a chance to watch any of them this year.

Tier 1
1. Dahlin - Obviously

Tier 2
2. Noah Dobson - I've watched him more than the others. I think he's got a complete game. Reminds me of Doughty when he was coming out. He does everything very well, and has the defensive chops to be a #1. He may not have the dynamic skating of Boqvist/Hughes.... but he's no slouch offensively. His outlet passing is elite and he jumps in to the play and creates offense from within the zone as good as anyone. There is a hunger, and higher value placed on D who can skate like the wind. Dobson isn't that guy, and I think he'll be undervalued (mistakenly) on draft day by teams that covet that dynamic skillset that Boqvist and Hughes have. Dobson, on the other hand... is an IQ defensemen. He sees the lanes and space so well with and without the puck.

As of today, I would draft Dobson #2 overall. I think his draft narrative will go a lot like Miro Heiskanen's went last year. He wasn't viewed as a top tier guy going in to the season. But as the season wore on he kept working his way up draft boards. By June, I think he's universally be viewed as a top 5 pick. I think he's a guy with a decent chance to be the Doughty/Petriangelo of your blueline.... and if not, he's extremely likely to end up as a Dougie Hamilton type #2/3.

One of the best takeaways I've had this year, was the way he adapted his game for the Hlinka tournament. If you had watched him in the Q the prior year, you would've seen an aggressive puck dominant defensemen. A guy who could rush the puck, who would transition from a hard outlet to joining the rush, etc. But at Hlinka, he transformed in to a patient, shutdown, matchup defensemen. He took away space, made the safe plays, didn't turn the puck over, etc. It showed he was coachable, that he could fit in different systems/roles, and from that point on.... I was sold.... and it certainly didn't hurt that he turned himself in to a dominant PP QB throughout this year in the Q.

3. Boqvist
4. Hughes

Tier 3
Wilde
Bouchard
Smith
McIsaac

Outcome I want.... in order of preference

1. Win the lottery, win Dahlin, start winning
2. Draft Dobson, stabilize the backend with a #1 defensemen long term
3. Draft Hughes/Boqvist, change the backend with a dynamic skater
4. Draft Zadina, he can score on his own
5. Draft Tkachuk, at least we'd be fun to watch and have some identity.

Svechnikov is overrated
 

Jame

Registered User
Sep 4, 2002
52,673
9,037
Florida
I agree, i don't care what the quality of players even is. The second or third overall pick is a significantly more valuable asset then the 5th or 6th pick.

My statement wasn't in terms of value. It was in terms of handicapping our shitty scouting staff/GMs chances of doing something stupid.... like drafting Svechnikov over the impact defensemen in the draft.
 
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UnleashRasmus

Rasmus has gone Super Saiyan VI!
Apr 15, 2012
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Nashville Tennessee
there are 4 in a tier after Dahlin - Adam Boqvist of Brynas SHL, Evan Bouchard of the London Knights, Quinn Hughes of the University of Michigan, Noah Dobson of Acadie Bathurst of the QJMHL

there is no strong consensus in the ranking of them, probably will remain that way until the draft.

I just hope we don't take Hughes. The kid has serious questions on his decision making, defensive play and his shot is garbage. Derrick Pouliot - be your comp as far as I'm concerned. Yes, he can skate. However, if the rest of your game is sub par then what is the point. It's Boqvist, Bouchard, Dobson, Smith, McIsaac then Hughes for me.
 

Jame

Registered User
Sep 4, 2002
52,673
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Florida
@Jame,

I'm interested in a Teppo Numminen type: calm, controlling, vision, spacing, positioning, smart approach vs. relying solely on physical talents. Is Dobson in that mold?

I think if you watched him, paired with McIsaac, in the tournament, you would come away with that perception (calm/cerebral).

If you watch him in a typical Q game, you would come away with a different description leaning towards the aggressive/physical talent.

And that's honestly, the thing that gives me a high level of confidence in his chance of turning out (becoming a #1). He's not going to need to rely on his physical talents early in his development. He's going to be able to play a simple game, a smart/cerebral puck moving game. And as his development reaches the right stage, he's going to be able to flip that talent switch back on.

I like the Petriangelo comparison, because he did the same thing.
 

UnleashRasmus

Rasmus has gone Super Saiyan VI!
Apr 15, 2012
6,473
1,932
Nashville Tennessee
Tier 1
1. Dahlin - Obviously

Tier 2
2. Noah Dobson - I've watched him more than the others. I think he's got a complete game. Reminds me of Doughty when he was coming out. He does everything very well, and has the defensive chops to be a #1. He may not have the dynamic skating of Boqvist/Hughes.... but he's no slouch offensively. His outlet passing is elite and he jumps in to the play and creates offense from within the zone as good as anyone. There is a hunger, and higher value placed on D who can skate like the wind. Dobson isn't that guy, and I think he'll be undervalued (mistakenly) on draft day by teams that covet that dynamic skillset that Boqvist and Hughes have. Dobson, on the other hand... is an IQ defensemen. He sees the lanes and space so well with and without the puck.

As of today, I would draft Dobson #2 overall. I think his draft narrative will go a lot like Miro Heiskanen's went last year. He wasn't viewed as a top tier guy going in to the season. But as the season wore on he kept working his way up draft boards. By June, I think he's universally be viewed as a top 5 pick. I think he's a guy with a decent chance to be the Doughty/Petriangelo of your blueline.... and if not, he's extremely likely to end up as a Dougie Hamilton type #2/3.

One of the best takeaways I've had this year, was the way he adapted his game for the Hlinka tournament. If you had watched him in the Q the prior year, you would've seen an aggressive puck dominant defensemen. A guy who could rush the puck, who would transition from a hard outlet to joining the rush, etc. But at Hlinka, he transformed in to a patient, shutdown, matchup defensemen. He took away space, made the safe plays, didn't turn the puck over, etc. It showed he was coachable, that he could fit in different systems/roles, and from that point on.... I was sold.... and it certainly didn't hurt that he turned himself in to a dominant PP QB throughout this year in the Q.

3. Boqvist
4. Hughes

Tier 3
Wilde
Bouchard
Smith
McIsaac

Outcome I want.... in order of preference

1. Win the lottery, win Dahlin, start winning
2. Draft Dobson, stabilize the backend with a #1 defensemen long term
3. Draft Hughes/Boqvist, change the backend with a dynamic skater
4. Draft Zadina, he can score on his own
5. Draft Tkachuk, at least we'd be fun to watch and have some identity.

Svechnikov is overrated

This is a solid write up. I've liked what I've seen with Dobson as with Bouchard. However, I guess I haven't watch as much as you have Jame. Props on this.
 

MayDay

Registered User
Oct 21, 2005
12,661
1,146
Pleasantville, NY
When's the last time a team traded back/up in the top of the draft?

The last time a top 5 pick was traded was 2010 (#2 overall from Toronto to Boston in exchange for Phil Kessel).

The last time a team traded down from a top 5 pick was 2008, when the Isles started with #5 overall and traded down twice to wind up at #9.

Columbus traded down from #4 to #8 in 2004.

The last time a team traded down from #1 overall was 2003, when Florida moved back from #1 to #3.
 
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ek93

Registered User
Dec 28, 2014
1,664
1,187
New York
I don't want the 2nd or 3rd pick.

We need the lottery balls to bring us a Defensemen.... either win the lottery for Dahlin, or get leap frogged in the lottery and land in the #4/5 spot for one of the next tier of Defensemen.
100% this. Forces us to actually draft for need and not end up like the Oilers.
 
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