2017 U Sports Playoffs/University Cup (March 16th-19th in Fredericton, NB)

[connor macdavid]

National Capital Bid?

Heard an interesting rumour the other day regarding a Carleton/uOttawa joint bid for back-to-back championships at TD Place in Ottawa.

Think it's a great idea. Venue is a perfect size (5,800-ish with upper deck curtained off, as 67's currently do, 9,000-something when totally open), and it would be nice for both of those programs to get a shot at participating in a national tournament.

Again, just a rumour and not substantiated by anybody from either school.

 

[SP Saskatuned]

Huskies win off the ice ...

The University of Saskatchewan Huskies may have lost the University Cup final game, but they managed to win over a few hearts out in Fredericton, N.B. ....

http://thestarphoenix.com/sports/lo...ung-fan-gain-admiration-of-fredericton-family

 

[Rob]

Heard an interesting rumour the other day regarding a Carleton/uOttawa joint bid for back-to-back championships at TD Place in Ottawa.

Think it's a great idea. Venue is a perfect size (5,800-ish with upper deck curtained off, as 67's currently do, 9,000-something when totally open), and it would be nice for both of those programs to get a shot at participating in a national tournament.

Again, just a rumour and not substantiated by anybody from either school.

Hope it's true. I have a lot of friends in Ottawa. More importantly a free place to stay.

 

[AUS Fan]

Not sure if OU is ready for prime time yet. I know Patty is pushing for big things in their program and this could be one of those. I suppose if Carleton hosted year 1 then OU wouldn't have to be "competitive" until 2019-2020 season.

If it happens, we can all stay with Rob's friends.

 

[Rob]

Not sure if OU is ready for prime time yet. I know Patty is pushing for big things in their program and this could be one of those. I suppose if Carleton hosted year 1 then OU wouldn't have to be "competitive" until 2019-2020 season.

I would have to guess that Carleton would host the first year. Seeing how Ottawa played last year they should be fine by then.

If it happens, we can all stay with Rob's friends.

The more the merrier. I love cuddles.

 

[Hollywood3]

These regulations are pliable from year to year. Nobody is arguing what the regulations say now, but we're arguing that the regulations will change in a scenario where the OUA is the host.

Also, in answer to an earlier question:

"I'm not sure where you got that wording from, but it's not correct.
Here is the link to the USports Policy:

http://en.usports.ca/information/mem...ms_-FINAL-.pdf

And here is the wording from that document:

20.20.4.7 Men’s Ice Hockey Championship
8 Team Format, Single Elimination
4 Regional Associations
1 Host
1 Assigned berth OUA Regional Association
1 Assigned berth CWUAA Regional Association
1 Assigned berth AUS Regional Association"

The link you posted was for the 2015-16 season, and it's dated August of 2015. The 2016-17 playing regulations once again use the word "rotating" to refer to the final three spots. No idea if that wording change was to allow more future flexibility, but it's certainly possible. See section 3.1 of this doc:

http://en.usports.ca/information/me...7/NEW/170118_PlayingRegs_Hockey_-M-_FINAL.PDF

Those change every year. The main rule is this:

20.20.1.7 The CIS Sport Committee may also assign to Regional Associations additional berths to a National Championship. These additional berths will be assigned based on the principle that the most competitive teams should advance to National Championships.

20.20.1.8 The CIS Sport Committee may approve championship formats which include at-large berths assigned to a university. These additional at-large berths will be assigned based on an objective selection process as approved by the Sport Committee and will be assigned based on the principle that the most competitive teams should advance to National Championships.

I would argue that the hockey policy has been bastardized beyond all recognition. For one, the RSEQ has never had a league. There are only 3 regional associations. If Quebec forms a league then fine. Until then, tough luck.

I also have a problem in how they allocate a berth when the host qualifies through conference playoffs. The rules don't provide for this. At one time, this was NOT the case.

By proper application of the rules the qualifiers should have been St. FX, UNB, York, Queen's, Alberta, and Sask. The last two spots would then go to selections like with basketball. I'd prefer awarding one spot and a playoff for the other.

 

[Hollywood3]

What if the host wins the Queens Cup, or is runner up? Then a lesser team would get the host slot? When Lakehead hosted they did not get 4 teams. They got the usual 3 with AUS and then CW getting the extra slot. I realize that it was a 6 team tourney, but I can't see the OUA getting 4 teams.

I have no inside knowledge, and at times have been told I know nothing, but I'm willing to bet that, should the OUA host, they will get 3 slots.

In those days they made a rule that the rotating berth would skip the host conference.

 

[Hollywood3]

Outside of the Saddledome what other rinks could they use?

The old Stampede Corral is still standing. It holds 6,475.

And there is the newer Markin MacPhail Centre, which holds 3,922. It was used for a Team Canada v Calgary/MRU/Lethbridge game.

And the Dinos once used their Max Bell Centre, which holds 2,122.

The Dinos' regular arena is the Father David Bauer Arena and it holds just 1,750. MRU plays at the Flames Community Arenas and those are even smaller.

 

[Drummer]

Heard an interesting rumour the other day regarding a Carleton/uOttawa joint bid for back-to-back championships at TD Place in Ottawa.

Think it's a great idea. Venue is a perfect size (5,800-ish with upper deck curtained off, as 67's currently do, 9,000-something when totally open), and it would be nice for both of those programs to get a shot at participating in a national tournament.

Again, just a rumour and not substantiated by anybody from either school.

I talked to some OU guys at UCup and they did hint they are considering it, but after the next bid round so that's 2021 & 2022.

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

The old Stampede Corral is still standing. It holds 6,475.

And there is the newer Markin MacPhail Centre, which holds 3,922. It was used for a Team Canada v Calgary/MRU/Lethbridge game.

And the Dinos once used their Max Bell Centre, which holds 2,122.

The Dinos' regular arena is the Father David Bauer Arena and it holds just 1,750. MxRU plays at the Flames Community Arenas and those are even smaller.

But, has anyone in CanadaWest, outside of Alberta, even hinted at hosting?

 

[MiamiHockey]

Those change every year. The main rule is this:



I would argue that the hockey policy has been bastardized beyond all recognition. For one, the RSEQ has never had a league. There are only 3 regional associations. If Quebec forms a league then fine. Until then, tough luck.

I also have a problem in how they allocate a berth when the host qualifies through conference playoffs. The rules don't provide for this. At one time, this was NOT the case.

By proper application of the rules the qualifiers should have been St. FX, UNB, York, Queen's, Alberta, and Sask. The last two spots would then go to selections like with basketball. I'd prefer awarding one spot and a playoff for the other.

The real trouble with having "at-large" picks is travel. With pre-determined spots, teams /leagues can plan well in advance.

And, yes, I know that basketball does that. But moving 12 basketball players and their clothing is far easier and less costly than moving 23 hockey players and their gear, as Queen's demonstrated this year.

 

[MiamiHockey]

The old Stampede Corral is still standing. It holds 6,475.

And there is the newer Markin MacPhail Centre, which holds 3,922. It was used for a Team Canada v Calgary/MRU/Lethbridge game.

And the Dinos once used their Max Bell Centre, which holds 2,122.

The Dinos' regular arena is the Father David Bauer Arena and it holds just 1,750. MRU plays at the Flames Community Arenas and those are even smaller.

Calgary has a lot of great facilities, indeed.

Neither the Markin MacPhail nor David Bauer arenas are really suitable. Both have Olympic ice surfaces - not a huge issue - but FDB is just too small, and MM is way on the west end of town and difficult to access.

The Corral Centre would be ideal, both in terms of size and location. What a great barn.

Max Bell would draw a good crowd, as it is centrally located, but it just might be a bit too small.

 

[Hollywood3]

The real trouble with having "at-large" picks is travel. With pre-determined spots, teams /leagues can plan well in advance.

And, yes, I know that basketball does that. But moving 12 basketball players and their clothing is far easier and less costly than moving 23 hockey players and their gear, as Queen's demonstrated this year.

That argument does not work. The at-large picks were made the Sunday after the conference playoffs ended on a Saturday.

 

[Hollywood3]

But, has anyone in CanadaWest, outside of Alberta, even hinted at hosting?

Nobody has put in a bid from anywhere. Calgary and Regina did put in bids the last time it was the west's "turn".

 

[Drummer]

But, has anyone in CanadaWest, outside of Alberta, even hinted at hosting?

No bids have been submitted yet because USPorts hasn't published the available championships open for bidding and the rules associated with each event. I believe the window opens in June and ends in late August with the bids announced in September and winners announced in late September.

There were only two(2) bids the last time - UNB won out over UoToronto.

 

[cishockeyfan]

AUS Host. any team in the AUS is in good position to host if they chose to do so, and all teams are competitive even Dalhousie

UNB - Will host again eventually
Moncton - Now has a New Main venue, or could use the coliseum still
UPEI - The 3700 Seat Civic Centre or Newer 4500 Seat Summerside Credit Union Place
St Marys and Dalhousie - Can host no problem
Acadia & St FX - Can also host via Halifax, and I would argue may be able to host in their own Rinks that are smaller but would be sold out, and possibly just play the final in Halifax.

 

[cishockeyfan]

Canada West Host - whether any of the following teams would ever be interested is another story

Alberta - will eventually host again
Saskatchewan - will eventually host again

UBC - Is competitive enough - Their 7500 Seat Arena is Perfect - The Population to draw from in the area is massive. Unfortunately the UBC doesn't seem committed to their Varsity Hockey program at all

U of Calgary & Mount Royal - Whether a joint bid or separate, both would work, both teams are good. The Corral Center is also the perfect arena for it.

Manitoba - Good Program, beautiful MTS Centre, but some stated not possible with both the Jets/Moose in town

Regina & Lethbridge - 2 Perfect Sized Rink 6,200 seats & 5,400 Seats, but 2 programs that have not been competitive in years

 

[AUS Fan]

I think that any hosting in Halifax will depend on whether the city has CIS Final 8 B-ball. There are only so many sponsorship dollars to go around.

 

[cishockeyfan]

I think that any hosting in Halifax will depend on whether the city has CIS Final 8 B-ball. There are only so many sponsorship dollars to go around.

The Question is, and I don't know the answer. maybe someone on these boards has an idea.

Do we know at all, what the minimum attendance per game would have to be to break even or have a chance to break even based on presumed concession sales.

In the case of UNB, does selling 3000 Tournament passes guarantee they will make a huge profit or simply have a chance to break even.

Or compare to I have no doubt Wolfville would sellout their 1800 Seat Rink and Antigonish their 2300 Seat Rink for the Tournament, would that be enough that they will break even or make profit, or will they be guaranteed to lose money even with the presumed concession sales.

 

[cishockeyfan]

OUA East Host

McGill - Have been a University Cup regular for 10 years, and the only OUA team to make some noise there. Montreal has a huge population and a handful of suitable arenas

Concordia - Although not a powerhouse like McGill, they are now a good team, and everything else to the Montreal area applies

Queen's - Made some noise this year, Their home rink has a Capacity of 3300 and there is also the 5700 Seat K-Rock Center in Town

UQTR - Traditional National TOP 10 team with a lot of UCup Experience and a 2800 to 3200 Seat Rink, looks like a good spot to me

Carleton & UofOttawa - Joint or Separate Bids - TD Place or Steve Yzerman Arena - The Ravens are competitive and Ottawa should get there as well (They were before the leave of absence)

UOIT - Great Rink 5100 Seats Home of The Oshawa Generals, but not really there from a competitive standpoint

Laurentian - Ideal Rink 4600 Seats, but not there with their program

Nippising U - 4043 Seat Arena, North Bay seems like an ideal city to host (like Thunder Bay) The Hockey Program started off solid in their first couple of seasons, but have been on a downward trend since

RMC - No enough said

 

[cishockeyfan]

OUA West Host

Ryerson - I would love to see Ryerson Host, they had a great team this year, I want to see the tournament have another shot in Toronto, and I think the old Maple Leaf Gardens is the perfect spot to try. The Arena looks beautiful now, and while some say its too small, I would think the 2750 it holds is totally sufficient. The AUC in Fredericton holds 3,300 now. I think the tournament would center around the History of Maple Leaf Gardens, and this alone would generate some fans out there to attend the game simply cause of the history or people who haven't been in the rink since the leafs days. I myself have never traveled outside the Maritimes for the University Cup but I would for the tournament here, that is if UNB made the tourney

York U - Some good U Cup History here, would have to host likely at the downtown Ricoh Coliseum, not sure if it could work for York, 10,000 seat is a little big for the University Game in Toronto at least at this time

Guelph, Laurier and Waterloo - Lets get this one out of the way, while their is suitable good size rinks closer to their campuses than Kitchener was in the 2001 and 2002 disasters, I think History wins here. The Guelph and Laurier joint Hosting was a disaster and is still too fresh in everyone's mind to try again any time soon.

Brock U - suitable arenas in the arena, hockey team has never been elite, and really truly haven't been terrible either but I don't see interest coming from here in my mind?

Windsor - Kinda in the same boat as Brock, they have the facilities, they have the population to draw from, Never been a terrible team, but never really elite either. Would there ever be interest here?

Lakehead - Could and Should host again some day. I admit I expected bigger attendance numbers in thunder Bay when they hosted the tournament. But I think they went about selling the tickets wrong.

Western Ontario - This one Im curious about, huge population in the London Area, good hockey program, They have the beauty Budweiser Gardens in town. I dont know much about Thompson Arena, it says on Wikipedia it has a capacity of 3600 for hockey, but it looks like a dump kinda, or like its gone through a bunch of configuration changes over the years. does it still hold 3600?

U of Toronto - How the mighty have fallen. Listed as the second most successful University Hockey program in Canada behind only the Alberta Golden Bears and ahead of UNB. The Blues have dissapeared off the radar the past 25 seasons ever since Acadia dropped a 12-1 Nuke on them in the 1993 University Cup Final, ironically also hosted at Varsity Arena The Blues Home Rink. The Host of the tournament from 1988 to 1997 straight. I like Varsity Arena, Its a perfect size for this Tournament. The fan support was subpar and U of T is not going to host. Maybe they will let York Borrow the rink

 

[Duke Guy]

Regarding UOIT: They play at the Campus Ice Centre in North Oshawa which holds about 500 people.

 

[AUS Fan]

Too much to take in a single bite. I'll just fall back on my usual refrain: If the University team does not draw well on their own, they probably won't draw for a National Championship. Sudbury and North Bay have similar travel issues as T-Bay did: hard to get there. Trois Rivieres the same. Toronto would be expensive to stay there and as someone posted earlier, there is SO Much To Do there that hockey would be an afterthought.

Southern Ontario is Major Junior country, plain and simple. Acadia and SFX would draw the fans but have small rinks and limited hotel space. Halifax is not an option if CIS B-ball is also in town a week earlier. UPEI could do it, but again travel can be tricky.

There are a handful of possible hosts and a lot more that are unsuitable.

We can discuss this till the cows come home (to Sask) and not come up with a consensus.

Further to this, seating is not the only consideration. There must be room for 8 teams, all the TV stuff, media room, etc, etc. UNB is "suited" for a 6 team tourney, but was very cramped with 8 teams. And that was before Queens and McGill even arrived. Many factors other than just seating. Hotels, airlines, infrastructure are just a few.

 

[northvanman]

OUA West Host

Western Ontario - This one Im curious about, huge population in the London Area, good hockey program, They have the beauty Budweiser Gardens in town. I dont know much about Thompson Arena, it says on Wikipedia it has a capacity of 3600 for hockey, but it looks like a dump kinda, or like its gone through a bunch of configuration changes over the years. does it still hold 3600?

Thompson is an unusual arena. It has an indoor track around the rink. On the players bench side, there are permanent seats, with the lower tier being a set of portable bleachers that are rolled out over the track during games. This is the configuration used during the regular season. On the opposite side of the rink is a large set of portable bleachers that are recessed into the wall on the far side of the track. These are rarely rolled out, but tend to be used during years with deep playoff runs and for high school championships. Originally, the building was configured to seat 5,000, but portable bleachers at either end of the rink have been removed. 3600 sounds about right.

Having said all of that, if Western ever hosted I think they'd do it at Budweiser Gardens....it's a beautiful building. The one problem is that downtown London is a good hike from the campus - I'd guess about a 40 minute walk. Besides all of this, Western has been one of the most competitive hockey programs in the OUA over the past 30 years and their fan support has always been crap (just like most OUA programs). Students don't care about the program and locals support the Knights. I think the only locations in the OUA West that make any sense are Thunder Bay and Toronto (downtown, not at York which is in the far north end of the city and not easily accessible by public transit).

 

[AUS Fan]

"Western has been one of the most competitive hockey programs in the OUA over the past 30 years and their fan support has always been crap (just like most OUA programs)."


Vindication!!!