2017-2018 Blues Prospects Thread

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Dbrownss

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Ive changed my way of thinking involving d parters. Having a rover with a stay at home guy is predictable, especially with guys like Boumeester and Gunnarson. They bring zero offense. That could change with the new system though. As long as Dunn and Pie or Parry are on the same page, they will thrive. The problem comes when they have no chemistry
 
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Majorityof1

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Im no advanced stats guru....but from what we've seen of Gunnarsson doesn't point towards him being THAT hard to surpass. I remember last year several gaffs from him. I may not be remembering correctly but wasn't he benched a few times?

It's very possible that a comfortable Dunn can be looked at as a Shattenkirk. Passable at defense and the offense offsets it.

I'm not either, but I'll give it a go. Its hard to say what Gunnarsson's advanced stats should look like because he has been used very heavily in the defensive zone. He has 17% O-zone face-offs. I don't have a good stat sites for QoC yet, but I'd say he also has been out there against better comp. Based on the eye-test and starting line-ups (lacking a good most common linemate site), he has been paired mostly with out two big defensive guys in Parayko and Pie. They have been easing' Pie's workload by shifting the defensive responsibility more and more toward Parayko (again, eye-test), so Gunnar is along for the ride. Those two factors are going to heavily skew advanced stats like Corsi. Comparisons to Dunn, who has been sheltered and getting 40.5% Ozone starts, are going to be naturally skewed.

That said, Gunnar is actually pretty good. He is last on the team in CA/60 with 71.47. Dunn is 2nd with 58.68. Gunnar is also last in CF%, Dunn is 3rd. That's to be expected given all the D-zone starts. However, given such high Corsi (attempted shots against) he is actually very low on Scoring chances against. He is 2nd to Parayko in SCA/60 and SCF%. So lots of shots, not a lot of scoring chances. This is probably due in part to his high # of blocked shots which count as a Corsi event, but not a scoring chance (1st on team in blocked shots). There is also not a lot of high danger chances against as he leads the team in HDCA. He is also getting a good goalie save percentage as well, through luck or funneling chances to the right areas. Consequently, bottom line, his GA/60 and GF% are very good. Both 2nd on team to Dunn (who is heavily sheltered).

My interpretation based on eye-test and these stats, Gunnarsson is being asked to do JBOs job, or at least pick up a lot of the slack taking the heavy defensive LHD role. Most of this is a consequence of being partnered with Parayko who is getting more defensive responsibility. They are understandably giving up a lot of shot attempts given heavy defensive play, but they are limiting scoring chances due to steady defense. Even the chances are being funneled to places the goalies can make saves. Given the defensive work-load, it is very admirable that he has only been on ice for 2 GA 5v5. He's made some PK miscues, but his 5v5 has been remarkably steady given his role. And this is coming from someone who was hoping the stats would tell me Dunn was better, and Gunnarsson was over-rated. That's not the case, Gunanr has done remarkably well from a stats point of view in his role so far this year.
 

Dbrownss

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I'm not either, but I'll give it a go. Its hard to say what Gunnarsson's advanced stats should look like because he has been used very heavily in the defensive zone. He has 17% O-zone face-offs. I don't have a good stat sites for QoC yet, but I'd say he also has been out there against better comp. Based on the eye-test and starting line-ups (lacking a good most common linemate site), he has been paired mostly with out two big defensive guys in Parayko and Pie. They have been easing' Pie's workload by shifting the defensive responsibility more and more toward Parayko (again, eye-test), so Gunnar is along for the ride. Those two factors are going to heavily skew advanced stats like Corsi. Comparisons to Dunn, who has been sheltered and getting 40.5% Ozone starts, are going to be naturally skewed.

That said, Gunnar is actually pretty good. He is last on the team in CA/60 with 71.47. Dunn is 2nd with 58.68. Gunnar is also last in CF%, Dunn is 3rd. That's to be expected given all the D-zone starts. However, given such high Corsi (attempted shots against) he is actually very low on Scoring chances against. He is 2nd to Parayko in SCA/60 and SCF%. So lots of shots, not a lot of scoring chances. This is probably due in part to his high # of blocked shots which count as a Corsi event, but not a scoring chance (1st on team in blocked shots). There is also not a lot of high danger chances against as he leads the team in HDCA. He is also getting a good goalie save percentage as well, through luck or funneling chances to the right areas. Consequently, bottom line, his GA/60 and GF% are very good. Both 2nd on team to Dunn (who is heavily sheltered).

My interpretation based on eye-test and these stats, Gunnarsson is being asked to do JBOs job, or at least pick up a lot of the slack taking the heavy defensive LHD role. Most of this is a consequence of being partnered with Parayko who is getting more defensive responsibility. They are understandably giving up a lot of shot attempts given heavy defensive play, but they are limiting scoring chances due to steady defense. Even the chances are being funneled to places the goalies can make saves. Given the defensive work-load, it is very admirable that he has only been on ice for 2 GA 5v5. He's made some PK miscues, but his 5v5 has been remarkably steady given his role. And this is coming from someone who was hoping the stats would tell me Dunn was better, and Gunnarsson was over-rated. That's not the case, Gunanr has done remarkably well from a stats point of view in his role so far this year.
It is interesting but my mistrust of Gunnarsson is more based off of what we've seen previously.

Ultimately what Im getting at is when Boumeester comes, I'd rather keep Dunn in the lineup. He can pass and move the puck very well. I guess they could send Dunn back down and bring up Schmaltz. Im fearing a Gunnarson/Bortuzzo pairing. They just seem like they would get pinned in often
 

Majorityof1

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It is interesting but my mistrust of Gunnarsson is more based off of what we've seen previously.

Ultimately what Im getting at is when Boumeester comes, I'd rather keep Dunn in the lineup. He can pass and move the puck very well. I guess they could send Dunn back down and bring up Schmaltz. Im fearing a Gunnarson/Bortuzzo pairing. They just seem like they would get pinned in often

No, I get that. This has been a very small sample size and Gunnar is paired with Parayko, not Bortuzzo. As I said, Gunnar is filling in for Jbo's role. Dunn is filling a completely separate and distinct role. With JBO back, you will still need a LHD to play in offensive situations. That is not Gunnarsson. My point was merely that Gunnarsson has done a good job in the role he has been used in this season, and we can't expect Dunn to fill that role anytime soon. I think Gunnarsson is at his best when he's a poor-man's top-4 shutdown D. When he is relegated to a sheltered 3rd pairing role, he does not do as well.
 
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STL fan in MN

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For now I’d probably keep Gunnar over Dunn. It’s close though. Dunn won’t be hurt to go get #1 minutes and man the #1 PP in the AHL.

They’re such vastly different players so what it’ll very likely come down to is which complements the other 5 guys the most. Do they need a steady D first vet or a rookie with Good offensive instincts but still has a lot to learn? Again, it’s close but as of today I’d go with Gunnar. It won’t take much improvement from Dunn or regression from Gunnar for me to change my mind though.
 
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Dbrownss

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I was shocked that Dunn played 20min against the lightening. My feeling is that he's here to stay. I dont know how the log jam is undone.

Its possible Gunnarson is moved. He's a good option for teams looking for help. Vegas wants alot for their Meh guys....they make pay a decent price for Gunnarson, especially with his uptick in play. Ultimately I dont think we'll "miss" him in the grand scheme of things.
 
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Personally, I'd keep Gunnarson in the lineup over Dunn when Bouwmeester comes back if Gunnar continues to play the way he has. I wouldn't be upset to see Dunn stay in the lineup, but if that happens then I want to see the coaching staff stick with him through the growing pains. He needs to play, a lot.
 

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Ive changed my way of thinking involving d parters. Having a rover with a stay at home guy is predictable, especially with guys like Boumeester and Gunnarson. They bring zero offense. That could change with the new system though. As long as Dunn and Pie or Parry are on the same page, they will thrive. The problem comes when they have no chemistry

So what you're saying is, to be unpredictable the Blues should run the offense through Bouwmeester and Gunnarson, to try to catch the other team off-guard? That's a bold strategy. I like it.
 
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Dbrownss

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So what you're saying is, to be unpredictable the Blues should run the offense through Bouwmeester and Gunnarson, to try to catch the other team off-guard? That's a bold strategy. I like it.
lol....it also catches Gunny off guard too given his reactions
 

2 Minute Minor

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I was shocked that Dunn played 20min against the lightening. My feeling is that he's here to stay. I dont know how the log jam is undone.

Its possible Gunnarson is moved. He's a good option for teams looking for help. Vegas wants alot for their Meh guys....they make pay a decent price for Gunnarson, especially with his uptick in play. Ultimately I dont think we'll "miss" him in the grand scheme of things.

I think they may keep 8 up on D for a while. I do think eventually Gunnarson will be traded if everyone is healthy.

Megan and Paajarvi could be sent down. I wonder whether Paajarvi is likely to be claimed. But I think Blais will be a regular starter sooner than Paajarvi. Is Barbashev waiver eligible?
 

STL fan in MN

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Barbashev is still waiver exempt. Blais and Dunn are the other two currently on the roster that are waiver exempt as well.
 

2 Minute Minor

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They've exposed Paajarvi before. If he were lost it would not be a major set-back. I took the Upshall signing as a signal that Paajarvi isn't strong enough on the PK or other 4th line roles. Otherwise we may see the team waive Upshall when Steen comes back. But he meshes with the team so well, its hard to imagine that (and Upshall hasn't played poorly).
 

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I rather keep Gunnar, but in pressbox. Run with Dunn that long when he hits wall if not they mission compeleted. I still believe Dunn will give us another option for 2nd PP and really could drive that powerplay at blueline. Ofc Gunnar has everything on experience and maybe bit better at d-zone, but know how much Dunn has proved his overall game in all 3-zones. And like I said when he hits wall bring Gunnar back. Gunnar doesn't go bad or good at pressbox, but sit kid like Dunn in pressbox is major mistake if that happends. If they want Gunnar and Bortuzzo play then send Dunn AHL and bring Prosser to pressbox.

Code:
Edmundson - Pietro
Jbo - Parayko
Dunn - Bortuzzo

xtras: Gunnar
 

STL fan in MN

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That was an awesome write up. Very in-depth with video evidence. I hope he makes the team next year.

Yeah, it was pretty clear the writer knew what he was talking about.

Kyrou is an elite skater. Many have very good straight away speed but Kyrou’s lateral mobility and edge work are also outstanding. I think he has a good shot of making the Blues next season as long as he continues to round out his game.

He should be a key cog for Canada in the WJC this season too which will be good experience for him.
 

Jordeau

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Based on what I've read in the Sarnia thread on the OHL board Kyrou has already been better defensively than last season. The fans there seem much happier with his overall effort and compete level than they were in the past.
 

Oberyn

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Based on what I've read in the Sarnia thread on the OHL board Kyrou has already been better defensively than last season. The fans there seem much happier with his overall effort and compete level than they were in the past.
I've heard the same as well. Perhaps getting the "C" has motivated Kyrou to be more a leader on his team. I'm happy to hear that his effort level away from the puck has increased.
 

thigpen

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I rather keep Gunnar, but in pressbox. Run with Dunn that long when he hits wall if not they mission compeleted. I still believe Dunn will give us another option for 2nd PP and really could drive that powerplay at blueline. Ofc Gunnar has everything on experience and maybe bit better at d-zone, but know how much Dunn has proved his overall game in all 3-zones. And like I said when he hits wall bring Gunnar back. Gunnar doesn't go bad or good at pressbox, but sit kid like Dunn in pressbox is major mistake if that happends. If they want Gunnar and Bortuzzo play then send Dunn AHL and bring Prosser to pressbox.

Code:
Edmundson - Pietro
Jbo - Parayko
Dunn - Bortuzzo

xtras: Gunnar

I've been a little disappointed with Bortuzzo at times, especially when he loses his composure in battles or his positioning in the D zone. Still think he's ideally a 7th D man. For this reason, I wouldn't mind seeing JBo replace him in the lineup or move Gunnar to his spot. Both of those guys have filled in on the right side pretty well at times in the past and are sheltered a bit on the 3rd pairing. Sit Bortz and send Prosser through waivers.

Edmundson - Pietro
Jbo - Parayko
Dunn - Gunnarson

or

Edmundson - Pietro
Gunnarson - Parayko
Dunn - Jbo
 
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The Note in MI

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I've heard the same as well. Perhaps getting the "C" has motivated Kyrou to be more a leader on his team. I'm happy to hear that his effort level away from the puck has increased.

If he's been better then I shudder to think what he may have been last year!

He's still clearly offensive minded. He is capable of very solid defense but it's a motivation thing from what I can tell. Very Tarasenko like actually
 

Oberyn

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If he's been better then I shudder to think what he may have been last year!

He's still clearly offensive minded. He is capable of very solid defense but it's a motivation thing from what I can tell. Very Tarasenko like actually
Oh it was awful last year. Sting fans couldn't stand Kyrou at times despite his offensive production due to his terrible play away from the puck.
 

bleedblue1223

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Good to hear that about Kyrou. Maybe becoming captain or this past camp with the Blues knowing that he's closing to making it if he rounds out his game really lit a fire under him. Someone with the speed and skill of his would be a great addition.
 

MissouriMook

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Good to hear that about Kyrou. Maybe becoming captain or this past camp with the Blues knowing that he's closing to making it if he rounds out his game really lit a fire under him. Someone with the speed and skill of his would be a great addition.
I would expect that the coaching staff would have sent him back to Sarnia with some very specific things to work on this season, particularly the defensive aspects of his game.
 

joshyhockey26

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Plenty of prospects representing their leagues in the Canada-Russia series coming up. Tanner Kaspick (WHL), Jordan Kyrou(OHL), Robert Thomas(OHL) and Evan Fitzpatrick(QMJHL).
 

Oberyn

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Kyrou with a 4 point night. 18 points in 9 games so far, not too shabby.
 
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