2017-18 Kings News/Rumors/Tidbits

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Reaper45

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Jul 14, 2003
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The thing with Carter is that now to get full value, you need to let him play. I’d trade him in season to get better value, which no matter what some of you think... is still a top prospect, a good young player and a 1st... he’s a better player than both E.Kane and Max PAC with term on his contract at a bargain rate!
Heck, I’d do Carter for Skinner and Bean
I could live with that but if Voynov is indeed coming back soon they need to clear cap space soon.
 

Reaper45

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Jul 14, 2003
37,160
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Los Angeles
Calling it now...

Kempe and Vilardi for Skinner
Toffoli and Pearson for ROR
Voynov returns after the trade deadline

Kopitar
Skinner
Carter
ROR
Brown
Lewis
Iafallo
Reider
Amadio
Thompson
Clifford
Andreoff
Rhempel
Brodzinski

Doughty
Voynov
Muzzin
Martinez
Phaneuf
Forbort
LaDue
 

go4hockey

Registered User
Oct 14, 2007
6,180
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Alta Loma CA
Vanek has outproduced Pearson since he joined the NHL, outproduced Toffoli the past two years, basically outproduced Brown his entire career besides this season, and put up significantly more points than Kempe this season. Not to mention he didn't go 30+ games without a goal like Kempe did this year.

There is more to the game that points. The guy has good hands and will get some points. The rest of his game is sub par and his game isn’t nearly as good when the games matter most.
 

GoldenBearHockey

Registered User
Jan 6, 2014
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Yep. One of the 'downsides' to having such a prospect is that he will be the piece everyone asks for before they maybe 'lower' their ask to kempe and a high pick or something.

Depending on the ask, the Kings could serious look at moving Vilardi,

I think it would take a 24 year or younger, winger with a track record, think Nik Ehlers out of WPG, there's not many of them out there...and I'm not saying the other teams would consider it, but if such a deal comes around, LA can't go, Vilardi. no, and hang up, they gotta listen to it, I'd take a 23 year old winger like Pastarnak, over the CHANCE that Vilardi maybe as good, and maybe even better? Don't know...won't know for a few years now, as of today, Boston comes around and says, we want to deal Pastarnak, we want Vilardi, 1st in 2019, and Martinez....I think we say, ok Pastarnak and Grzelyck, and let's call it a deal. Or something to that affect
 

go4hockey

Registered User
Oct 14, 2007
6,180
2,418
Alta Loma CA
Calling it now...

Kempe and Vilardi for Skinner
Toffoli and Pearson for ROR
Voynov returns after the trade deadline

Kopitar
Skinner
Carter
ROR
Brown
Lewis
Iafallo
Reider
Amadio
Thompson
Clifford
Andreoff
Rhempel
Brodzinski

Doughty
Voynov
Muzzin
Martinez
Phaneuf
Forbort
LaDue

Blake should be instantly fired if he made the first trade. That is god awful for the Kings. Talk is if Buffalo is moving ROR they are looking for a young defenseman so how does that deal work for them.
 
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BigKing

Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
Mar 11, 2003
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The importance of Vilardi's full ELC not-yet-being-used cannot be underestimated here.

Vilardi is Blake's signature guy at this point. It would take a pretty wild deal for him to be included in something: especially for a winger since they believe Vilardi will eventually be a C in the NHL.

Pastrnak is great but he's making $6.6MM for the next five seasons. You'd have to move other contracts to make it work.

These guys are staying the course and like the core. I think they are banking on Vilardi being the 2C for the 2020 season which allows Carter to move to wing with Kempe at 3C. Maybe Amadio shows well enough to be 3C and they wind up moving Kempe to wing.

I don't know how it will all shake out, but I'm pretty sure they envision Vilardi as the 2C to Kopitar's 1C with that possibly flipping if/when Kopitar slows down.

I love Pastrnak, but I don't love the idea of flipping the best cost-controlled asset the franchise has had since Brayden Schenn for a $6.6MM winger while hoping the over-30 crew at 1C and 2C stay upright to support said winger.
 

GoldenBearHockey

Registered User
Jan 6, 2014
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The importance of Vilardi's full ELC not-yet-being-used cannot be underestimated here.

Vilardi is Blake's signature guy at this point. It would take a pretty wild deal for him to be included in something: especially for a winger since they believe Vilardi will eventually be a C in the NHL.

Pastrnak is great but he's making $6.6MM for the next five seasons. You'd have to move other contracts to make it work.

These guys are staying the course and like the core. I think they are banking on Vilardi being the 2C for the 2020 season which allows Carter to move to wing with Kempe at 3C. Maybe Amadio shows well enough to be 3C and they wind up moving Kempe to wing.

I don't know how it will all shake out, but I'm pretty sure they envision Vilardi as the 2C to Kopitar's 1C with that possibly flipping if/when Kopitar slows down.

I love Pastrnak, but I don't love the idea of flipping the best cost-controlled asset the franchise has had since Brayden Schenn for a $6.6MM winger while hoping the over-30 crew at 1C and 2C stay upright to support said winger.

Here's the problem, you don't know if Vilardi is going to become a Brayden Schenn or David Pasternak, or if he's going to become a Kerby Rychel or Frederick Gauthier, you simply do not know.

So you want to bank on the CHANCE of him being the best cost controlled player, vs having a bonafide scoring threat....
 

King'sPawn

Enjoy the chaos
Jul 1, 2003
21,811
20,603
So you want to bank on the CHANCE of him being the best cost controlled player, vs having a bonafide scoring threat....

YES.

The Kings need a younger core, and there's no guarantee that bonafide scoring threat will be the same threat playing on a top defensive team.

Selling high end youth to get more proven older players is why the Kings are where they are. The core needs the next wave to take ownership of this team.
 

BigKing

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Here's the problem, you don't know if Vilardi is going to become a Brayden Schenn or David Pasternak, or if he's going to become a Kerby Rychel or Frederick Gauthier, you simply do not know.

So you want to bank on the CHANCE of him being the best cost controlled player, vs having a bonafide scoring threat....

One in the hand is worth two in the bush except if the one in the hand doesn't make this team a Cup contender and you need two hands to hold the cap hit.

You aren't just trading Vilardi, you are also going to have to shed salary in other deals. Do the subsequent deals make the Kings that much of a better team than last season?

I understand the thought process and Pastrnak isn't an old player by any means, but the Kings need some high-end production from ELC contracts and Vilardi seems like the best bet at this point.

The idea here is to add young talent with upside while retaining your own young talent with upside. Vilardi is hopefully someone who can help short-term but is also a long-time play at a more important position. Kings need to add more of these type of players before they start moving the ones they have.

Not to beat a dead horse, but I'd rather move Carter for young talent/futures than trade Vilardi for a $6.6MM winger coming back the other way simply because I don't think Pastrnak all of a sudden vaults this team to the top.

If they were that close this season without Vilardi, then Blake should be taken to task for not getting Kane for a 2nd round pick for this payoff run. They weren't that close, however, and Luc/Blake knew it.
 

GoldenBearHockey

Registered User
Jan 6, 2014
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One in the hand is worth two in the bush except if the one in the hand doesn't make this team a Cup contender and you need two hands to hold the cap hit.

You aren't just trading Vilardi, you are also going to have to shed salary in other deals. Do the subsequent deals make the Kings that much of a better team than last season?

I understand the thought process and Pastrnak isn't an old player by any means, but the Kings need some high-end production from ELC contracts and Vilardi seems like the best bet at this point.

The idea here is to add young talent with upside while retaining your own young talent with upside. Vilardi is hopefully someone who can help short-term but is also a long-time play at a more important position. Kings need to add more of these type of players before they start moving the ones they have.

Not to beat a dead horse, but I'd rather move Carter for young talent/futures than trade Vilardi for a $6.6MM winger coming back the other way simply because I don't think Pastrnak all of a sudden vaults this team to the top.

If they were that close this season without Vilardi, then Blake should be taken to task for not getting Kane for a 2nd round pick for this payoff run. They weren't that close, however, and Luc/Blake knew it.

I understand that we need production from ELC contracts, all I am saying is that you are presented with a 23 year or younger winger, you absolutely have to explore that. And while adding 6.6 would require movement if all we were doing is trading futures for him, let's say the trade is Vilardi, a 1st in 2020 and Martinez for Pasternak and Grzelyk, you really only add 2.6 million, or the equivalent of Reider's QO, if you have to, you deal Thompson and run with Amadio and Brodziak etc, but you can't just say out of hand, nope, won't make that deal etc.

I don't think that's a deal Boston makes anyways, but I was just throwing him out there as an example as something that makes you think because in this league, absolutely one in the hand is worth two in the bush,
 

BigKing

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Depends on what the one in the hand is worth what the two in the bush could be, factoring in the probability of the prospect reaching his ceiling. It is a lot different offering Vilardi up now as opposed to the #11OA pick prior to the draft last year.

I'm not saying Boston would do it either and, if we are talking Vilardi, then a young, proven player like Pastrnak isn't the worst type of return to be discussed. Where the Kings are at right now though, I'm more interested in what the Kings could do with the Vilardi and the difference between his cap and Pastrnak's since they aren't one winger away.

While the team needs better wingers, Vilardi might be that type of player that makes lower-cost wingers better due to his vision and passing skills. While Pastrnak is much younger than Carter, if Carter remains on the team and is productive, you could be looking at Vilardi centering Carter by 2020 for a cap hit of $350k less than just Pastrnak with the possibility of Vilardi on Carter or Kopitar's wing as soon as next season.

I'm the first one on here to pump the brakes about just inserting prospects into the Top 6 or Top 4, but all signs point to the Kings believing this is a real possibility. If they truly believe they can win with this core, then Vilardi adds to it next season for less than a $1MM while adding Pastrnak would lead to probably moving one of Martinez/Muzzin which really hurts the blueline.

I totally get what you are saying though. He's coming off a monster year, is young, and is a steal at the $6.6MM cap hit if he maintains last year's numbers. I just feel this team isn't really contending unless they are able to add without subtracting.

I know this is coming from the guy saying to move salary for Tavares so that may seem contradictory since Tavares contract will take him through older years and be a higher number, but then I'm talking about having a 1 and 2C of Kopitar/Tavares while still having Vilardi in the mix on his ELC.

All of this moot though since I'm not expecting much action from Blake this summer.
 

GoldenBearHockey

Registered User
Jan 6, 2014
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Agree, the issue is, they are at truly a cross roads, the core is still very very good, and they can still take another shot or two at contending, despite what the doom and gloom in here want to believe, OR they can take advantage and move the core, to rebuild rapidly, but A. there is no recipe for success there, and B. you can't move Brown or Kopitar without their consent, harder said than done, especially with Brown.

I think Blake is going to take it slow this summer, might kick tires on a few FAs etc, but when it comes down to camp, I think he's really gonna take a hard look at Brickley, Clague, Ladue and Fantenberg, and see if there is something there that would allow him to move a Martinez for futures....and then the same with Vilardi, take a look, make sure....and depending on where they at at the deadline, possibly move Carter.....if Vilardi can handle the pro game
 

BigKing

Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
Mar 11, 2003
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Agree, the issue is, they are at truly a cross roads, the core is still very very good, and they can still take another shot or two at contending, despite what the doom and gloom in here want to believe, OR they can take advantage and move the core, to rebuild rapidly, but A. there is no recipe for success there, and B. you can't move Brown or Kopitar without their consent, harder said than done, especially with Brown.

I think Blake is going to take it slow this summer, might kick tires on a few FAs etc, but when it comes down to camp, I think he's really gonna take a hard look at Brickley, Clague, Ladue and Fantenberg, and see if there is something there that would allow him to move a Martinez for futures....and then the same with Vilardi, take a look, make sure....and depending on where they at at the deadline, possibly move Carter.....if Vilardi can handle the pro game

Many of us thought they were a black hole team or a bottom-tier playoff team going into the season and that proved to be the case, although some will state that Carter missed so much time and that they would have had a better record.

I think Management believes in the Carter theory and, to a lesser extent, the Quick theory from 2017. If the key members of the core stay healthy, the young guys continue to improve and someone like Vilardi can have an immediate 45-50 point impact then look out. If they think Vilardi can do that at under $1MM, they just roll with that and keep their powder dry. Regardless, I think they are in playoff contention at the deadline--barring key injuries--so Blake won't be moving Carter no matter how good Vilardi is. Maybe in the 2019 off-season, but not at the deadline.

Vilardi is really key to this whole thing though. If they are just going to run this core into the ground, they need major production from ELC and 2nd contract guys. If he is a stud, that goes a long way towards giving this team a chance to contend within the next two seasons. If Clague can step in with a solid 14-15 minutes a night in 2020, that would also be a very big help.

If they stand pat for the most part, I think 2020 might be the best chance for this current core when the current batch of prospects/youth might be able to produce enough secondary scoring/defense to make the team hard to shut down. Of course, a lot can happen between now and then and it would have been much better for the cavalry to be coming this season, hence the constant discussion of Lombardi mortgaging the future. That mortgaged future is now so you have to have a lot of faith in the prospects and the ability of the core to remain at a high level two seasons from now to be cool with just standing pat or not moving older guys (Carter) for younger assets.
 

AlphaBravo

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Jan 31, 2015
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Agree, the issue is, they are at truly a cross roads, the core is still very very good, and they can still take another shot or two at contending, despite what the doom and gloom in here want to believe, OR they can take advantage and move the core, to rebuild rapidly, but A. there is no recipe for success there, and B. you can't move Brown or Kopitar without their consent, harder said than done, especially with Brown.

I think Blake is going to take it slow this summer, might kick tires on a few FAs etc, but when it comes down to camp, I think he's really gonna take a hard look at Brickley, Clague, Ladue and Fantenberg, and see if there is something there that would allow him to move a Martinez for futures....and then the same with Vilardi, take a look, make sure....and depending on where they at at the deadline, possibly move Carter.....if Vilardi can handle the pro game


You hit the nail on the head here. How our young defensemen perform is key to how this team improves. We are solid on defense, and if one or two of these guys provide strong performances and secure a spot in the top 4, we would have the luxury of moving Martinez or Muzzin as a center piece in a trade for a top 6 winger. I don't see us overpaying for a UFA. Blake may perhaps take a chance on lower level UFAs like he did last year with Cammy, but I think he is going to just stay the course and draft well.

I was pretty disappointed, but not surprised when we lost to Vegas in the first round. But after seeing the Sharks and Jets also get steamrolled, in hindsight we did not do that bad. Our defense was at least solid. We should need to really boost our offense if we want to stay competitive. Vilardi and adding a top 6 winger in a trade will be key.
 

LAKings88

First round fodder
Dec 4, 2006
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If LAs powerplay produced at all, they could have beat Vegas. I still think that was the biggest hinderance to The offensive output. Playoffs are tough. Need to capitalize on special teams.
 
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BigKing

Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
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If LAs powerplay produced at all, they could have beat Vegas. I still think that was the biggest hinderance to The offensive output. Playoffs are tough. Need to capitalize on special teams.

Completely agree. I wanted the match-up because I didn't respect their defense that much and felt the Kings had an advantage in net and on the PK so it would be imperative to pot some PP goals.

Turns out they didn't have as much of an advantage in net as I hoped and the Kings were just abysmal on the PP.
 
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lumbergh

It was an idea. I didn't say it was a good idea.
Jan 8, 2007
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If LAs powerplay produced at all, they could have beat Vegas. I still think that was the biggest hinderance to The offensive output. Playoffs are tough. Need to capitalize on special teams.
Mmm...No.
Kings scored one power play goal and gave up one power play goal, so special teams was pretty much a wash. The Kings lost the series at even strength, getting outscored 6-2. Even if the power play hit at 25%, that's just two more goals. They still would have lost. Maybe they win one game.
 

kingsfan28

Its A Kingspiracy !
Feb 27, 2005
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Completely agree. I wanted the match-up because I didn't respect their defense that much and felt the Kings had an advantage in net and on the PK so it would be imperative to pot some PP goals.

Turns out they didn't have as much of an advantage in net as I hoped and the Kings were just abysmal on the PP.

So was Vegas. they were what, 1-for 11? The Kings held their top line to 3 points, in 4 games. That same line had 12 in the 1st game vs the Sharks. The main problem, for what ever reason, was they didn't score. It's pretty well outlined here:

Kings doomed by lack of production in first-round sweep
 

LAKings88

First round fodder
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Without looking at 12-14, cause I’m lazy, I feel like the PP was a big part of those runs.

The point isn’t that LA and Vegas has similar washed out numbers on the pp. The point is that had LAs powerplay been on fire or effective that series could have changed. LA is a defensive team. They need to figure out how to make a man advantage effective. Especially in close games against Vegas. LA gave up freaking 7 goals people.

The only real advantage Vegas had was rolling four lines. Pretty much what they did each series.
 
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