OT: 2015 Redskins Part I: Building America's Football Capital (0-0-0)

[ChibiPooky]

Have at it.

Click to read more...

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

Interesting Shanny interview, from what I have listened to at this point.

Battery going dead on my phone, so can't elaborate more now, but from what I have heard its hard to have any faith the Skins will be more than a joke of the NFL for the foreseeable future with Snyder owning the team. And Griffin? He is the perfect face of this franchise.

 

[g00n]

http://www.csnwashington.com/redski...meltdown-rg3-robert-griffin-dr-james-andrews?

In the aftermath of Griffin's injury against Seattle, things truly fell apart. The coach said his quarterback no longer wanted to run, and was ready to be a pocket passer, but Shanahan did not think Griffin was ready for that.

"He never trusted me after I told him he wasn't ready to be a drop back passer," Shanahan said of Griffin.

But the QB had supporters in high places, none higher than Redskins owner Dan Snyder.

"Dan felt very strongly about Robert being a dropback quarterback," Shanahan said. "I knew my time was short-lived with that type of mindset, but Dan felt very strongly about that."

And to paraphrase an earlier part of this brief article, RG3 was supposedly upset that the Skins ran a different offense for Cousins vs Cleveland, after Robert was injured vs Baltimore. The question there is, did Snyder panic at that point because of the injury and tell Robert he shouldn't have to run a different offense than Cousins, or did Robert go to Snyder with that complaint? Seems unlikely to me that RG3 would abandon his style voluntarily, especially when he seemed to want to play through injuries and sacrifice his body even after previous injuries.

 

[Capitlols]

You would think the franchise couldn't sink any lower.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

http://www.csnwashington.com/redski...meltdown-rg3-robert-griffin-dr-james-andrews?



And to paraphrase an earlier part of this brief article, RG3 was supposedly upset that the Skins ran a different offense for Cousins vs Cleveland, after Robert was injured vs Baltimore. The question there is, did Snyder panic at that point because of the injury and tell Robert he shouldn't have to run a different offense than Cousins, or did Robert go to Snyder with that complaint? Seems unlikely to me that RG3 would abandon his style voluntarily, especially when he seemed to want to play through injuries and sacrifice his body even after previous injuries.

I have only heard the 1st four parts of the interview, but Cousins and the Cleveland game was talked about in what I have heard, and Shanahan never gave the impression Griffin's comments and actions during that time were influenced by out side forces. After the Cleveland game Shanahan was made aware by Matt Laflour that Griffin was upset Cousins didn't run the 50 series during the Cleveland game. Shanahan sat Griffin down and said he tried to explain to Griffin that the offense he runs for Griffin is different than what he runs for Cousins. That Shanahan runs the offense best suited for the particular QB. Griffin saw it as an insult, and things went down hill from there.

Griffin didn't have an issue taking one for the team, but he had an issue taking one for the team running the 50 series (read/option) offense, according to Shanahan, and that jibe's with what I remember hearing and reading in the media during the following off-season.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

I would like to take this time to sing the praises of one part of the Redskins organization that is doing a good job. The Redskins Charitable Foundation. I will try to be brief.

My Step-Father is finishing up his 2nd battle with leukemia in 6 years. He is currently in remission, but his recovery has been extremely rough. About a month ago he was really struggling with his health. Desperate for anything to raise his spirits I sent a message to the Redskins Charitable Foundation explaining my Step-Father's situation and wondering if a simple message of encouragement could be sent to my Step-Father from his favorite player, Sonny Jurgensen. 2 weeks later I get an email from someone from the Foundation asking for my Step-Father's mailing address.

And today I get a call from my Step-Father, as happy as I've heard him in a long time, because he just got a picture of Jurgensen with a message addressed to my Step-Father written on it and signed by Jurgensen. My Step-Father was as giddy as a kid going on about getting the picture framed and thanking me for making this happen. But the thanks goes to the Redskins Charitable Foundation for coming through on a desperate request and raising the spirits of a long time fan that really needed it.

For all that Dan Snyder has gotten wrong as owner of the Washington Redskins, he got one thing right with the Redskins Charitable Foundation.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I still despise him.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

You would think the franchise couldn't sink any lower.

Why would you think that? It's clear Snyder has learned nothing and to quote Remember the Titans, "attitude reflects leadership, captain." Captain Snyder is an insecure meddling child who continues to create the most toxic environment in professional football.

I will say, at least all of our disfunction is football related. We don't have guys running around cold cocking their wives, murdering dudes, ****** chicks in a bathroom.

 

[BobRouse]

This all makes sense now...

I can't believe I didn't put this together before hand.

RGs dad came out at that time saying he needed to be a pocket passer and the Shanny's didn't think he was ready but Snyder and the "G Camp" forced it.

Griffin's EGO is what led to his downfall

 

[RandyHolt]

Mike had full say in all personnel decisions. Or at least he told us he did.

So he lied then as he did not, or he is lying now.

Either way, he's a liar

Good luck sifting through the lies. I don't trust a word he said, as it reeks of a PR stunt and of him looking for a new job.

Shanny dragging his feet on drafting a QB is what led to his downfall. And if he is telling the truth that all bad moves were Dan's fault, then he needs to have that playoff visit and fine run in 2012 expunged from his resume. As full credit needs to go to Dan.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Hi, I'm Mike Shanahan and I presided over a historic failure. But every decision that I made was right. Everything that happened is someone else's fault.

 

[Capitlols]

Hi, I'm Mike Shanahan and I presided over a historic failure. But every decision that I made was right. Everything that happened is someone else's fault.

Yeah that's pretty much how I see it. Not to say that some of what he said isn't right.

 

[RandyHolt]

There could certainly be some truth to what he said. Allen is not a real GM. In fact he should take over capgeek.

If he was pressured to take McGrounder, RG3, he is a pushover if he really felt that those moves were horrible, yet signed off on them.

He does not come across as a pushover, however. He comes across as the exact opposite. More an egomaniac.

And why wait a full year to tell the story of his innocence?

 

[g00n]

This all makes sense now...

I can't believe I didn't put this together before hand.

RGs dad came out at that time saying he needed to be a pocket passer and the Shanny's didn't think he was ready but Snyder and the "G Camp" forced it.

Griffin's EGO is what led to his downfall

Well that's the question...who initiated the pocket passer thing? Did RG3 sell it to Snyder, and Snyder reflected back some statements that Shanahan later recognized coming out of RG3's mouth? Or was RG3 just upset and talking to his buddy, the owner, about what was going on and Snyder came up with an angle that he told his QB, who was young and impatient enough to echo the owner's words to his coach?

If you believe Shanahan, RG3 first came to him about this stuff very early and the words coming out of his mouth sounded like Snyder. Was it specific phrases, or did Shanahan and Snyder have conversations like this before, but it only took on weight after RG3 got injured and talked to Snyder?

Whatever it was, it was totally dysfunctional and very, very Redskinny.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

And why wait a full year to tell the story of his innocence?

Same reason why he didn't coach, or try to coach, last year in the NFL. Dan Snyder had to pay Shanahan the final year on his contract. If Shanahan started running his mouth before his last year was up I have no doubt Snyder would of done all he could to not pay Shanahan the last year he was owed. 7 million is a lot of money.

Shanahan's interview yesterday can be taken with a grain of salt to be sure, but a lot of what he said matches up with reports and rumors that came out towards the end of the '12 season up until Shanahan was fired. Chris Cooley at the beginning of his show yesterday said a lot of what Shanahan said was the truth, but there were areas where Shanahan could of elaborated more or was not totally honest. Cooley didn't elaborate specifically.

The timeline given by Shanahan was most interesting. The down word spiral began with the Cleveland game. Griffin starts pouting because Cousin's didn't run the 50 series, and Griffin couldn't understand Shanahan's reasoning behind behind why Shanahan runs a specific offense tailored to Griffin's skills and has to run a different offense tailored to Cousin's skills. That Griffin and Cousin's are 2 different types of QB's.

I remember, either before or after the Cleveland game, Griffin getting asked by the press about Cousin's potential performance, or performance, against Cleveland and Griffin emphatically stating he wasn't worried because the Skins were "my team". That was a red flag for me at the time because Griffin came off as feeling threatened by Cousin's with that comment. And nothing up to that point suggested, based on Griffin's performance on the field, that anything Cousin's did on the field was going to take the starting spot from Griffin. After the Cleveland game Griffin makes his feelings known on the 50 series and Griffin starts being less than truthful to Shanahan about his health (specifically his knee).

In the end what us Skins fans are left with is a high priced QB (draft pick wise) who is also high maintenance and has a very large ego. The type of ego stroked by a jock sniffing owner and a bronze statue of himself down in Baylor. Hard to imagine the Griffin era in DC will ever reach the excitement and promise of 2012 based on what we know now. Time to start hoping for a miracle.

 

[Jacoby4HOF66]

Well that's the question...who initiated the pocket passer thing? Did RG3 sell it to Snyder, and Snyder reflected back some statements that Shanahan later recognized coming out of RG3's mouth? Or was RG3 just upset and talking to his buddy, the owner, about what was going on and Snyder came up with an angle that he told his QB, who was young and impatient enough to echo the owner's words to his coach?

If you believe Shanahan, RG3 first came to him about this stuff very early and the words coming out of his mouth sounded like Snyder. Was it specific phrases, or did Shanahan and Snyder have conversations like this before, but it only took on weight after RG3 got injured and talked to Snyder?

Whatever it was, it was totally dysfunctional and very, very Redskinny.

According to the Shanahan interview the 1st sign of an issue was Shanahan noticing Griffin "wasn't himself" after the Cleveland game and when he asked Matt Lafleur he was told Griffin was upset that Cousin's didn't run the 50 series against Cleveland. And despite Shanahan's best efforts to explain to Griffin why Cousins's didn't run the 50 series, Griffin never seemed to understand why and it was an issue between the two from that point on until Shanahan was fired.

So I read it as Griffin feeling he was just as good a pocket passer as Cousins and people like Snyder and RG2 reinforced Griffin's beliefs moving forward.

 

[Beef Invictus]

The thing that makes me look at Shanahan's comments with great skepticism is how he's clearly painting himself as a blameless sacrificial lamb. That's total nonsense. There's a clear bias and self-serving interest as he tries to re-invent his damaged image. I'm sure there's a kernel of truth he's built around; I'm also sure this isn't exactly accurate.

 

[RandyHolt]

So Dan got us into the playoffs, well I guess someone should stop to thank for him for that, since he gets so little praise.

Ok, no praise.

 

[EroCaps]

Hi, I'm Mike Shanahan and I presided over a historic failure. But every decision that I made was right. Everything that happened is someone else's fault.

Shanahan certainly handled his exit poorly with the leaks and all, but the failure of Griffin and the organization lays primarily at Snyder's feet.

Griffin isn't a dropback passer and I'm sure his owner siding with him only supported that delusion.

Dan is ****ing clueless, narcissistic, and arguably the worst owner in Pro Sports at this point.

 

[g00n]

According to the Shanahan interview the 1st sign of an issue was Shanahan noticing Griffin "wasn't himself" after the Cleveland game and when he asked Matt Lafleur he was told Griffin was upset that Cousin's didn't run the 50 series against Cleveland. And despite Shanahan's best efforts to explain to Griffin why Cousins's didn't run the 50 series, Griffin never seemed to understand why and it was an issue between the two from that point on until Shanahan was fired.

So I read it as Griffin feeling he was just as good a pocket passer as Cousins and people like Snyder and RG2 reinforced Griffin's beliefs moving forward.

Right, but how much of that was enabled or even possibly started by Snyder? That's the question. When you have the owner meddling with the handling of the QB, and the QB going to the coach in a overt or covert display of "this is what your boss wants", then you have real problems as an organization because the owner just totally blew up the chain of command between the QB and the coach. It fits precisely with the rumors we heard.

Even if Robert felt the way he did, I view that as potentially natural. Of course he's going to wonder about it, and it's normal for him to talk to his confidants about it. But the correct reaction would have been for Snyder to respect the hierarchy he himself set up and allay Robert's fears with some pep talk, and then discuss the issue with Shanahan. Snyder gummed up the whole system by being too close to Robert and undermining his own coach. If we assume Robert talked to his family/camp, wouldn't he also have talked to Snyder who is the one person in his "campe" who actually had the power to do something about it? I think absolutely so.

And like beef said, Shanahan is probably not totally blameless in this, either.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I assume everyone is to blame and that everyone involved royally botched their part in everything, because that's the most Redskins thing that could happen; and therefore, the most likely IMO.



But as always, it all begins at one place: Snyder.

 

[Maruk moustache]

I switched to being a Texans fan because of Snyder after what went down in 2013. Just fed up. I live in Texas nowadays anyway. I guess I'd be unable to if I still lived in DC, and I'd just sit around being irritated, but all the stuff got too much for me last year and it wasn't as hard to switch as I thought it would be. I mean, not rooting for Washington was easy. Having my heart in it when I try to root for Houston isn't, but I'll keep trying.

It's pretty drastic, I know--after 30+ years of rooting for Washington. I didn't make the decision without a lot of thought. But I'm so much less irritated now. I'm a much happier person. My psychologist is a lot poorer now.

It all starts at the top.

If Snyder sells the team before I die, I definitely will immediately return.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

There is no way I could root for another team. There is a certain feeling I get when the B&G runs on the field that couldn't be replaced by another team. When I lived in San Diego for five years I wanted to see the Chargers do well, but I can't turn off whatever it is that's in my brain that causes me to root for the Skins. I don't blame you though. EroCaps nailed it; Snyder is a diluted narcissist, and rooting for this franchise is an exercise in frustration and futility. When they do poorly, I'm both happy and angry. Happy that Snyder is unhappy but angry at the garbage product they put on the field. Vice versa for when they win. Snyder is the worst.

 

[Maruk moustache]

There is no way I could root for another team. There is a certain feeling I get when the B&G runs on the field that couldn't be replaced by another team. When I lived in San Diego for five years I wanted to see the Chargers do well, but I can't turn off whatever it is that's in my brain that causes me to root for the Skins. I don't blame you though. EroCaps nailed it; Snyder is a diluted narcissist, and rooting for this franchise is an exercise in frustration and futility. When they do poorly, I'm both happy and angry. Happy that Snyder is unhappy but angry at the garbage product they put on the field. Vice versa for when they win. Snyder is the worst.

I feel that way only about the Capitals I think. They were my first love. Even if Snyder bought them I wouldn't stop loving them.

I like football a lot but not nearly like I like hockey, and I really got seriously angry about Snyder re some of the stuff Shanny was talking about referenced in the last few posts and RG3 and just lots of other meddling type stuff from the past--like it was really seriously affecting my life. Y'know, people always cried about Al Davis meddling too much, but he's really a football guy--former coach and all that. So for me Davis's meddling was a different kettle of corn altogether. What is Snyder, some kind of businessperson, playing fantasy football? I dunno. And, you can't deny that he's good at making money off the team, and he'd get a great return on his investment if he were to sell on top of it, and that just makes me more upset about everything.

I was yelling at my girlfriend about him one day and she got scared. Really didn't like the latest coach hire. Just decided I'd had enough.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Fair points my man. I don't disagree. Hockey is and will always be my first love. I grew up in a family of Hartford Whalers season ticket holders. If they came back, I'd have two favorite teams. I will always love the Whale, but I've been a Caps fan since 97 so I couldn't just turn it off.

Football used to be 1b for me, and now it's not close. It's just not enjoyable for me any more. It's a combination of Snyder, me hating myself for giving him $$ as a sth, Goddell, the off field garbage, grown men oodling over college kids in their underwear at the combine... it's just totally over the top and I don't enjoy it nearly as much as I used to.