2004 draft plateaus

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by KingPurpleDinosaur, Apr 10, 2004.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. KingPurpleDinosaur

    KingPurpleDinosaur Bandwagon Kings Fan

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2002
    Messages:
    2,897
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    irvine, ca
    Home Page:
    not quite as knowledgeable as eveyrone else in this draft, but can someone tell me where the major plateaus are for this draft? is it like this...

    #1... plateau
    #2-5... plateau
    #5-15... plateau

    etc? from wat I read, that's as much as I could garner. The talent is basically in the top 15 right?
     
  2. Fighter

    Fighter Always on the move

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2004
    Messages:
    10,514
    Likes Received:
    119
    Trophy Points:
    141
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Traveller
    Location:
    Trieste, Italy
    Imo the plateaus are:

    #1: Ovechkin is a talent on his own.

    #2-#3: Malkin and Olesz

    #4-#10: From barker to... who knows?

    #10-#15

    #15-#30.
     
  3. in the hall

    in the hall Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2004
    Messages:
    5,009
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    from what i gather i feel it goes like this:

    #1 Ovechkin

    - a fair drop off in overall package mostly due to Ovechkin being so NHL ready

    #2 Malkin

    - not so huge of a drop off as people may think because of the hype Ovechkin gets but one none the less

    #3-#4 ideally Olesz is the better of he and Barker, however it depends on needs

    - a significant drop off in either skill or development

    #5-6 Ladd and Schremp, people may feel Ladd could go higher which may be the case but judging fairly, Ladd does not have the credentials the consensus top 4 have despite him being on a path going north 100MPH, Shremp can rival any player here skill wise.. would anyone be surprised if 10 years down the road he was the best player coming out of this draft?

    - i think here is where there is a giant fall out because players available outside of this have a lot left to be desired about, either lacking development or certain skill sets

    #7-#13

    - another significant drop off, more of the mystery guys, chipchura etc

    #14-25

    - same as above but the flaws are glorified, can't really say for much else because i wouldn't know enough but it is purely guess from here on my part

    #26-second round
     
  4. Hiishawk

    Hiishawk Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2002
    Messages:
    1,225
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Out there somewhere
    Home Page:
    Consensus among observers is that there is a lull at about nos. 16-18. This could change slightly depending on the current World U18s performances.
     
  5. Big McLargehuge

    Big McLargehuge Registered User

    Joined:
    May 9, 2002
    Messages:
    68,832
    Likes Received:
    1,091
    Trophy Points:
    215
    Location:
    S. Pasadena, CA
    1
    *fair drop-off*
    2
    *gigantic drop-off*
    3-5
    *fair drop-off*
    6-7
    *large drop-off*
    8-15
    *large drop-off*
    16-rest
     
  6. in the hall

    in the hall Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2004
    Messages:
    5,009
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Malkin is not not even close to as big of a drop off from Olesz as he is from Ovechkin.. you wouldnt happen to be a pens fan by any chance ;)
     
  7. Big McLargehuge

    Big McLargehuge Registered User

    Joined:
    May 9, 2002
    Messages:
    68,832
    Likes Received:
    1,091
    Trophy Points:
    215
    Location:
    S. Pasadena, CA
    my thoughts before the lottery results.

    The difference between Malkin and whoever goes third is huge IMO, always has been.
     
  8. craig1

    craig1 Registered User

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2002
    Messages:
    4,207
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Financial Manager/Scholar
    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Home Page:

    If you read the Pens board, you'll notice that this was said repeatedly for the past couple months. That's why a lot of Pens fans wanted to finish last. We knew the lottery was a crapshoot, but the vast majority were touting how the draft had 2 major players, and a few a good step behind. It's not because they lost the lottery. Some of us (IE: me) were saying....and go look at the Pens board...that Malkin might actually be the better fit for the Pens, even though AO is the superior talent.
     
  9. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,764
    Likes Received:
    2,968
    Trophy Points:
    186

    Sorry, but biased and a Pens fan though I am, that is just plan wrong and a re-write of history, albeit recent history. Though anyone would want Ovechkin, Malkin was the reason finishing last was such a battle cry for us, the drop is no longer that great and we knew that well before losing the top pick. The general consensus amoung scouts and those in the know is that Ovechkin is plateau #1 . . . #2 is Malkin, all alone too . . . and then a big big drop off from 3 on . . . and Malkin has been climbing closer to number one all year . . .

    Posted before, but relevant again. From http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tri...e/s_188112.html


    Quote:
    "If I'm picking No. 1, I'd think about drafting Malkin," said one prominent director of scouting. "I'd probably chicken out in the end and take Ovechkin, but I'd think about it."

    Quote:

    David Conte, director of scouting for the New Jersey Devils, said of the 6-foot-3, 186-pound Malkin, "It's not like he's a consolation prize. With this guy, the sky's the limit."

    Quote:

    "You went over wondering who the top '86-born European was," Kelley said. "Malkin just stood out, heads and tails above the others. As a centerman, he was unbelievable backing up the play at both ends of the ice."
     
  10. in the hall

    in the hall Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2004
    Messages:
    5,009
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    well here is my take, i never got the same impression and i have nothing to be biased about, to say the drop off is gigantic after malkin is absurd

    i am not blind, i take your opinions however there is reason to believe you are each bias also i can't believe the thought of the penguins finishing dead last was too difficult a couple months back, specially when ovechkin was the prize focused on

    i'll feel more comfortable when i see other opinions from people with no reason to be bias but for now i'll stay with what i believe
     
  11. Big McLargehuge

    Big McLargehuge Registered User

    Joined:
    May 9, 2002
    Messages:
    68,832
    Likes Received:
    1,091
    Trophy Points:
    215
    Location:
    S. Pasadena, CA
    we may be biased now but we've, or at least I have been saying this for months.

    Malkin will be a damn good player, a star in the NHL.

    Guys like Olesz...all stars perhaps, but I don't hold nearly as much hope for them as I do for Malkin.

    Same opinion throughout the season.
     
  12. DJ Spinoza

    DJ Spinoza Registered User

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    17,185
    Likes Received:
    170
    Trophy Points:
    141
    Gender:
    Male
    I don't think Olesz is that far of a drop off. There is one, but Olesz is a good player also. Malkin is a better finisher and gets things accomplished, whereas Olesz has very good vision. Malkin is a more 'explosive skater' too.

    This is going almost all by what I have read in a few places... McKeen's and Redline to be specific.
     
  13. ParisSaintGermain

    ParisSaintGermain Registered User

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2004
    Messages:
    4,395
    Likes Received:
    244
    Trophy Points:
    111
    IMO what makes Malkin a 2nd pick as opposed to Olesz is just the fact he is younger. This is just about it for me.
    Olesz as Ovechkin have been playing in adults league while Malkin struggled up there. But because Malkin looked very good during the WHJC, he has got some kind of potential edge. I feel that nothing is as fixed as what we want to believe on these boards. I expect to be very surprised when the draft occurs.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2004
  14. X-SHARKIE

    X-SHARKIE Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2003
    Messages:
    9,362
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Janesville Wisconsin
    Home Page:
    1= Ovechkin
    *Solid drop off.
    2-4 Malkin Barker Olesz
    *solid dropp off
    5-10
    *solid dropp off
    11-20*
    Slight drop off
    21-26
    *solid drop off
    27-30

    IMO.
     
  15. Hockeycrazed07

    Hockeycrazed07 Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2002
    Messages:
    2,361
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Disturber of Feces.
    Location:
    Buena Vista, VA
    Home Page:
    I don't think the difference between Malkin and Ovechkin is as pronounced as many, and lots of folks have seen me say so. We've got to remember the Malkin is late in this draft, and Ovechkin is Day #1...so much so that Florida wasted a pick on him last year. Ovechkin is better right now, but the gap in draft status isn't as pronounced as it seems.

    ~Crazed.
     
  16. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,764
    Likes Received:
    2,968
    Trophy Points:
    186
    I have not even downloaded a film clip of any of them, all has gone by the reports we all have seen, but I will say that this was not monday morning quarterbacking once the Caps got the first pick . . . not by me, or any of the Pen's fans that I see posting here. We all were desperate for the Pens to finish that last when it seemed assured during the 18 game losing streak, and again that month the Pens kept winning as everything that I have read says that this is a two person draft, about half the things that I have read say that there is a bit of a drop between Ovechkin and Malkin, then a huge drop after Malkin . . . the other half say that Malkin is climbing and the gap is not big at all, not nearly what it was at the beginning of this year. Nowhere have I read that anyone else approaches Malkin in most scouts eyes let alone Ovechkin, and this has been so for the past few months that I have been paying attention, was so three months before the draft, remains so now. Craig Patrick said it was a two person draft right after we secured last and that we had assured ourselves of one of the two. He did not even have to say the name of the two, that speaks volumes enough.
     
  17. EroCaps

    EroCaps Registered User

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2003
    Messages:
    16,720
    Likes Received:
    361
    Trophy Points:
    154
    Location:
    Virginia
    Ovechkin is what, 9 months older than Malkin, roughly the same height, with more muscle? IMO Ovy and Malkin reign supreme over this draft class, but Ovy > Malkin any day of the week.
     
  18. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,764
    Likes Received:
    2,968
    Trophy Points:
    186

    I actually don't disagree, not with a word of the above. The degree of differences between the two I have seen variences on opinion, none have Malkin hugely under Ovechkin though, but by the same token none (except for that one comment by NJ's chief scout that said that he would be tempted to take Malkin first) have Ovechkin anything but the best in the draft. I wish the Pens had won the lottery, Ovechkin is the sure thing, but I was not too upset because Malkin is not that far off. But be happy, anyone would rather have the sure thing all others are measured by.
     
  19. EroCaps

    EroCaps Registered User

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2003
    Messages:
    16,720
    Likes Received:
    361
    Trophy Points:
    154
    Location:
    Virginia
    As a fan of the game, I like the idea of Malkin a Penguin. The Pens are one of the better teams at developing youth, and could do a lot of good with a player of Malkin's stature and potential. In the end, Ovechkin may score more points, but success is measured in Stanley Cup Rings, and both players have the ability to cornerstone a franchise. :cheers:
     
  20. Jaded-Fan

    Jaded-Fan Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    43,764
    Likes Received:
    2,968
    Trophy Points:
    186
    :cheers: to you as well . . . good to be able to have a rivelry and still agree now and then
     
  21. Hiishawk

    Hiishawk Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2002
    Messages:
    1,225
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Out there somewhere
    Home Page:
    I agree. Malkin is not a shoo-in for #2, although he has the EDGE on Olesz at this point- largely due to age. McKeen's wrote a fair bit about how close the two are but they give the edge to Malkin. Frankly, I'm a little surprised how many people have Malkin as a clear-cut #2 and drop Olesz as far as #6 or #7.

    I haven't heard anything like that from scouts or scouting services.
     
  22. Hockeycrazed07

    Hockeycrazed07 Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2002
    Messages:
    2,361
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Disturber of Feces.
    Location:
    Buena Vista, VA
    Home Page:
    Did I say anything to counter this? People on this board in particular need to take their sticks from between their legs. What I said was that the gap isn't as wide as it's perceived to be. I said that Ovechkin was better, but that Malkin isn't as far back as people seem to make it out to be. I'd call the gap between 1 and 2 a small gap, but a gap nonetheless. Please don't assume I said something that I didn't. Thanks.

    ~Crazed.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

monitoring_string = "358c248ada348a047a4b9bb27a146148"