2004 draft plateaus

Status
Not open for further replies.

Fighter

Registered User
Jan 1, 2004
11,687
902
Trieste, Italy
Imo the plateaus are:

#1: Ovechkin is a talent on his own.

#2-#3: Malkin and Olesz

#4-#10: From barker to... who knows?

#10-#15

#15-#30.
 

in the hall

Registered User
Mar 4, 2004
5,009
0
from what i gather i feel it goes like this:

#1 Ovechkin

- a fair drop off in overall package mostly due to Ovechkin being so NHL ready

#2 Malkin

- not so huge of a drop off as people may think because of the hype Ovechkin gets but one none the less

#3-#4 ideally Olesz is the better of he and Barker, however it depends on needs

- a significant drop off in either skill or development

#5-6 Ladd and Schremp, people may feel Ladd could go higher which may be the case but judging fairly, Ladd does not have the credentials the consensus top 4 have despite him being on a path going north 100MPH, Shremp can rival any player here skill wise.. would anyone be surprised if 10 years down the road he was the best player coming out of this draft?

- i think here is where there is a giant fall out because players available outside of this have a lot left to be desired about, either lacking development or certain skill sets

#7-#13

- another significant drop off, more of the mystery guys, chipchura etc

#14-25

- same as above but the flaws are glorified, can't really say for much else because i wouldn't know enough but it is purely guess from here on my part

#26-second round
 

in the hall

Registered User
Mar 4, 2004
5,009
0
Handsome B. Wonderful said:
1
*fair drop-off*
2
*gigantic drop-off*
Malkin is not not even close to as big of a drop off from Olesz as he is from Ovechkin.. you wouldnt happen to be a pens fan by any chance ;)
 

Big McLargehuge

Fragile Traveler
May 9, 2002
72,188
7,741
S. Pasadena, CA
in the hall said:
Malkin is not not even close to as big of a drop off from Olesz as he is from Ovechkin.. you wouldnt happen to be a pens fan by any chance ;)

my thoughts before the lottery results.

The difference between Malkin and whoever goes third is huge IMO, always has been.
 

craig1

Registered User
Nov 1, 2002
4,207
0
Pittsburgh, PA
Visit site
in the hall said:
Malkin is not not even close to as big of a drop off from Olesz as he is from Ovechkin.. you wouldnt happen to be a pens fan by any chance ;)


If you read the Pens board, you'll notice that this was said repeatedly for the past couple months. That's why a lot of Pens fans wanted to finish last. We knew the lottery was a crapshoot, but the vast majority were touting how the draft had 2 major players, and a few a good step behind. It's not because they lost the lottery. Some of us (IE: me) were saying....and go look at the Pens board...that Malkin might actually be the better fit for the Pens, even though AO is the superior talent.
 

Jaded-Fan

Registered User
Mar 18, 2004
52,446
14,304
Pittsburgh
in the hall said:
Malkin is not not even close to as big of a drop off from Olesz as he is from Ovechkin.. you wouldnt happen to be a pens fan by any chance ;)


Sorry, but biased and a Pens fan though I am, that is just plan wrong and a re-write of history, albeit recent history. Though anyone would want Ovechkin, Malkin was the reason finishing last was such a battle cry for us, the drop is no longer that great and we knew that well before losing the top pick. The general consensus amoung scouts and those in the know is that Ovechkin is plateau #1 . . . #2 is Malkin, all alone too . . . and then a big big drop off from 3 on . . . and Malkin has been climbing closer to number one all year . . .

Posted before, but relevant again. From http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tri...e/s_188112.html


Quote:
"If I'm picking No. 1, I'd think about drafting Malkin," said one prominent director of scouting. "I'd probably chicken out in the end and take Ovechkin, but I'd think about it."

Quote:

David Conte, director of scouting for the New Jersey Devils, said of the 6-foot-3, 186-pound Malkin, "It's not like he's a consolation prize. With this guy, the sky's the limit."

Quote:

"You went over wondering who the top '86-born European was," Kelley said. "Malkin just stood out, heads and tails above the others. As a centerman, he was unbelievable backing up the play at both ends of the ice."
 

in the hall

Registered User
Mar 4, 2004
5,009
0
well here is my take, i never got the same impression and i have nothing to be biased about, to say the drop off is gigantic after malkin is absurd

i am not blind, i take your opinions however there is reason to believe you are each bias also i can't believe the thought of the penguins finishing dead last was too difficult a couple months back, specially when ovechkin was the prize focused on

i'll feel more comfortable when i see other opinions from people with no reason to be bias but for now i'll stay with what i believe
 

Big McLargehuge

Fragile Traveler
May 9, 2002
72,188
7,741
S. Pasadena, CA
we may be biased now but we've, or at least I have been saying this for months.

Malkin will be a damn good player, a star in the NHL.

Guys like Olesz...all stars perhaps, but I don't hold nearly as much hope for them as I do for Malkin.

Same opinion throughout the season.
 

DJ Spinoza

Registered User
Aug 7, 2003
25,140
3,678
I don't think Olesz is that far of a drop off. There is one, but Olesz is a good player also. Malkin is a better finisher and gets things accomplished, whereas Olesz has very good vision. Malkin is a more 'explosive skater' too.

This is going almost all by what I have read in a few places... McKeen's and Redline to be specific.
 

ParisSaintGermain

Registered User
Jan 19, 2004
5,408
1,682
IMO what makes Malkin a 2nd pick as opposed to Olesz is just the fact he is younger. This is just about it for me.
Olesz as Ovechkin have been playing in adults league while Malkin struggled up there. But because Malkin looked very good during the WHJC, he has got some kind of potential edge. I feel that nothing is as fixed as what we want to believe on these boards. I expect to be very surprised when the draft occurs.
 
Last edited:

Hockeycrazed07

Registered User
Jun 15, 2002
2,361
3
Buena Vista, VA
www.hockeycrazed.com
I don't think the difference between Malkin and Ovechkin is as pronounced as many, and lots of folks have seen me say so. We've got to remember the Malkin is late in this draft, and Ovechkin is Day #1...so much so that Florida wasted a pick on him last year. Ovechkin is better right now, but the gap in draft status isn't as pronounced as it seems.

~Crazed.
 

Jaded-Fan

Registered User
Mar 18, 2004
52,446
14,304
Pittsburgh
I have not even downloaded a film clip of any of them, all has gone by the reports we all have seen, but I will say that this was not monday morning quarterbacking once the Caps got the first pick . . . not by me, or any of the Pen's fans that I see posting here. We all were desperate for the Pens to finish that last when it seemed assured during the 18 game losing streak, and again that month the Pens kept winning as everything that I have read says that this is a two person draft, about half the things that I have read say that there is a bit of a drop between Ovechkin and Malkin, then a huge drop after Malkin . . . the other half say that Malkin is climbing and the gap is not big at all, not nearly what it was at the beginning of this year. Nowhere have I read that anyone else approaches Malkin in most scouts eyes let alone Ovechkin, and this has been so for the past few months that I have been paying attention, was so three months before the draft, remains so now. Craig Patrick said it was a two person draft right after we secured last and that we had assured ourselves of one of the two. He did not even have to say the name of the two, that speaks volumes enough.
 

EroCaps

Registered User
Aug 24, 2003
18,026
1,636
Virginia
Hockeycrazed07 said:
I don't think the difference between Malkin and Ovechkin is as pronounced as many, and lots of folks have seen me say so. We've got to remember the Malkin is late in this draft, and Ovechkin is Day #1...so much so that Florida wasted a pick on him last year. Ovechkin is better right now, but the gap in draft status isn't as pronounced as it seems.

~Crazed.

Ovechkin is what, 9 months older than Malkin, roughly the same height, with more muscle? IMO Ovy and Malkin reign supreme over this draft class, but Ovy > Malkin any day of the week.
 

Jaded-Fan

Registered User
Mar 18, 2004
52,446
14,304
Pittsburgh
EroCaps said:
Ovechkin is what, 9 months older than Malkin, roughly the same height, with more muscle? IMO Ovy and Malkin reign supreme over this draft class, but Ovy > Malkin any day of the week.


I actually don't disagree, not with a word of the above. The degree of differences between the two I have seen variences on opinion, none have Malkin hugely under Ovechkin though, but by the same token none (except for that one comment by NJ's chief scout that said that he would be tempted to take Malkin first) have Ovechkin anything but the best in the draft. I wish the Pens had won the lottery, Ovechkin is the sure thing, but I was not too upset because Malkin is not that far off. But be happy, anyone would rather have the sure thing all others are measured by.
 

EroCaps

Registered User
Aug 24, 2003
18,026
1,636
Virginia
Jaded-Fan said:
I actually don't disagree, not with a word of the above. The degree of differences between the two I have seen variences on opinion, none have Malkin hugely under Ovechkin though, but by the same token none (except for that one comment by NJ's chief scout that said that he would be tempted to take Malkin first) have Ovechkin anything but the best in the draft. I wish the Pens had won the lottery, Ovechkin is the sure thing, but I was not too upset because Malkin is not that far off. But be happy, anyone would rather have the sure thing all others are measured by.

As a fan of the game, I like the idea of Malkin a Penguin. The Pens are one of the better teams at developing youth, and could do a lot of good with a player of Malkin's stature and potential. In the end, Ovechkin may score more points, but success is measured in Stanley Cup Rings, and both players have the ability to cornerstone a franchise. :cheers:
 

Hiishawk

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
1,225
2
Out there somewhere
Visit site
ParisSaintGermain said:
IMO what makes Malkin a 2nd pick as opposed to Olesz is just the fact he is younger. This is just about it for me.
Olesz as Ovechkin have been playing in adults league while Malkin struggled up there. But because Malkin looked very good during the WHJC, he has got some kind of potential edge. I feel that nothing is as fixed as what we want to believe on these boards. I expect to be very surprised when the draft occurs.

I agree. Malkin is not a shoo-in for #2, although he has the EDGE on Olesz at this point- largely due to age. McKeen's wrote a fair bit about how close the two are but they give the edge to Malkin. Frankly, I'm a little surprised how many people have Malkin as a clear-cut #2 and drop Olesz as far as #6 or #7.

I haven't heard anything like that from scouts or scouting services.
 

Hockeycrazed07

Registered User
Jun 15, 2002
2,361
3
Buena Vista, VA
www.hockeycrazed.com
EroCaps said:
Ovechkin is what, 9 months older than Malkin, roughly the same height, with more muscle? IMO Ovy and Malkin reign supreme over this draft class, but Ovy > Malkin any day of the week.
Did I say anything to counter this? People on this board in particular need to take their sticks from between their legs. What I said was that the gap isn't as wide as it's perceived to be. I said that Ovechkin was better, but that Malkin isn't as far back as people seem to make it out to be. I'd call the gap between 1 and 2 a small gap, but a gap nonetheless. Please don't assume I said something that I didn't. Thanks.

~Crazed.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->